New semester; renewed loneliness

Well, it's that time again, I guess. It's a new semester, and I'm back on campus struggling to feel comfortable around people and failing. This always happens. I don't know why it always catches me off-guard, after all this time. I can never get used to it.

I struggle to keep myself from thinking about girls, because I doubt one will ever be interested in me. Honestly: I doubt one ever will. Pathetically, I've started randomly adding women on Facebook with whom I share mutual friends. Most don't respond, of course, because it's some stranger friending them. I don't know why I've started doing this, but I can't seem to stop. I can never talk to girls in real life and I guess some part of me, which has long craved at least some kind of female attention, has become pitifully desperate.

I started volunteering at my local library, and the people there were very nice to me. But I was nervous, so maybe I wasn't as talkative as I could have been. I think I'm getting the hang of everything; just didn't want to mess up anything.

I don't really know why I'm posting this. I'm better than I was just one year ago. I should be grateful for that.

Hiya John,

With regards to girls, at 25 years of age, you are a bit of a late bloomer to be finding that first special someone - but give yourself some slack. You've been out of school what... 4-5 years?

My boyfriend's first real girlfriend came into his life when he was 20 or so. He met her in college. A lot of people have their first real relationships then. You're just a little behind but it doesn't mean no one will ever love you.

My boyfriend says that the reason behind this was a) was clueless about girls liking him and b) he never had the guts to ask a girl out. He always tells me how he's so shy - which I didn't believe at first because in my group of friends he's the funny guy. Apparently that only happens for him in a couple social groups. In new social situations, he'll generally leave the area/room or retreat to a corner while I chat away with people. Its a social anxiety thing. He can fake it if he has to, but he generally dislikes being in new social situations and he retreats from them. He's always telling me a girl like me would never have dated him when he was in High School or college (he's 26 now by the way).

I am sure at one point in his life he was utterly convinced that he was not the kinda guy that was going to find love anytime soon. Then girl A stumbled into his life and lit up his world. They broke up. He somehow acquired enough confidence to go on to sleep with a handful of girls, and then one day he met me. I asked him out.

He cried in front of me once and told me he hated himself - it was the first time he had cried in four years (since girl A and him split). So I guess all that social anxiety and hurt is buried deep down there. He just doesn't let it show 99% of the time.

I love him though, even if he can't love himself. 100%. I think he's so funny and so charming and considerate and handsome. He's really easy going and sometimes a little too honest, and he'll always play with me and entertain my crazy ideas and I can't get enough of him.

My POINT here - sorry this is so lengthy - is that he felt the way you did. I think some days he still does. But he found his ex. He found all those girls he had casual relationships with. Then he found me. I don't think he ever predicted any of this. Things just happen. If they can happen to him, they can happen to you.

Trust me. Somewhere out there, there's a girl who has dated a ton of * * * * ty guys who have completely shaken her idea of trust in relationships (like me), and she may not know it yet, but when she meets you she'll know she had been waiting on finding a nice, patient, caring guy who treats her well. She'll love you to bits.

[...] I'm better than I was just one year ago. I should be grateful for that.

Good for you. You'll keep getting better at this. Sure, you'll have an occasional setback, such as you're seeing when new semesters start up--but those are brutal in their own way for everyone. It's system-shock, and it always requires getting acclimated.

Everyone is behind someone else in some area. Don't measure yourself against anyone else--and I think you understand this. The fact that you're comparing your OWN progress over last year is perfect. It's all cumulative.

Thank you for your responses, lucasky and catfeeder.

I'm at school, as I write this. Just sitting alone, as usual. Did some reading and studying.

Trust me. Somewhere out there, there's a girl who has dated a ton of * * * * ty guys who have completely shaken her idea of trust in relationships (like me), and she may not know it yet, but when she meets you she'll know she had been waiting on finding a nice, patient, caring guy who treats her well. She'll love you to bits.

I can't count how many times I've been told this. I appreciate it, though. I always thought I'd make a good boyfriend, but I've never been given a chance. Over time I just lost hope that it will ever happen for me, or even that it can. It will be a while before I can believe in that again.

Thank you for your responses, lucasky and catfeeder.

 

I'm at school, as I write this. Just sitting alone, as usual. Did some reading and studying.

 

 

 

I can't count how many times I've been told this. I appreciate it, though. I always thought I'd make a good boyfriend, but I've never been given a chance. Over time I just lost hope that it will ever happen for me, or even that it can. It will be a while before I can believe in that again.

Yeah, I know how you feel. I'm 26 years old, finished university and never had a girlfriend. There are times when I have difficulty believing that it will happen but you have to stay strong and stick it out. The day that it does happen will be all the more special. As you are in school, take advantage of social groups/clubs. Put yourself out there and make a good network of friends. It really makes a difference. Unfortunately for me, I was not fortunate enough to meet the right people, as many were acquaintances, extremely academic oriented (Forgoing outings for study time far too often) and not really the social types to go out very much. I only wished that I had met more interesting, chill and easy-going people when I was in university.

Even in such an environment where getting a girlfriend should be easily attainable, it doesn't work out for a lot of us either. But keep working on your social skills and improving yourself, that is the best thing you can do.

Thank you for the responses, everyone.

I'm hanging in there. And I'm trying to remain grateful for the progress I have made and the new opportunities that are presenting themselves.

On the "girl front," there are two very modest developments:

(1) A girl in my Logic class whom I've noticed. She has sat next to me twice (an accident?). Well, she seems cool. How would I go about talking to her?

(2) I have ended up getting into a "poke war" with a pretty girl on Facebook. Um, don't know what to make of this. Suggestions on what to do about it?

(1) Just talk to her and see how it goes.

(2) Just carry on, send messages, make comments, try and chat, see where it goes

(1) Yeah, but...like, how? Just introduce myself out of the blue, I guess?

(2) Again, how? What would I say?

Sorry if I seem clueless. Pathetic, I know.

(1) Yeah, but...like, how? Just introduce myself out of the blue, I guess?

 

(2) Again, how? What would I say?

 

Sorry if I seem clueless. Pathetic, I know.

You don't need a formal introduction to speak to your fellow classmates. Try making an offhand comment about the material or an assignment, the way you would with anyone else.

Think of it this way: if you've ever been stuck on a line at a grocery store or wherever and one of the people stuck there with you starts talking to you out of nowhere--a complaint about the store or a question about something you're buying, then it isn't likely you found that bizarre or extraordinary in any way. Same difference. But if that person broke silence by offering you a handshake to introduce themselves, that would be strange. So all you need to do is talk to the person next to you as though you're both standing on line. Not formal, just matter of fact.

The online stuff I can't really help you with other than to suggest speaking of a friend you have in common and how you know that person. From there you can raise an interest you share with the friend and ask if she does, too. For instance, if you both know Steve from different classes, you can tell her that you liked debating with Steve about xyz--is she interested in xyz, too?

Just concentrate on your studies for now as its more important for the time being. I have similar issues but not through the same situation, mine is more of a combonation of shyness and wanting more from a relationship. The way i deal with the sadness sometimes is through getting stuck in with a hobby, or some other outlet. I use art and sports to divert my attensions aswell as letting of steam. Theres nothing better than boxing on a heavy bag or smashing a 100+mph tennis serve to releave any stress or depression.

Ofcourse im not suggesting you do this, im just saying find something that you become passionate about and it will help you through the most difficult of times. I also find writing is a great way to clear your thoughts even if its just for you.

I think guys who have the classic "I can't talk to women" problem would benefit from practicing and realizing a few things. I guess the main reason we're nervous is the fear of failure, which comes from a situation where we place them in special category of potential love interests. I think being inexperienced talking with women leads guys to conceptualize them; they don't know what attractive women are really like so they imagine it.

If things were the opposite way, where you talked to all of them, you would quickly stop wishing they were all your girlfriend and realize how ordinary and down to earth most girls are. You'd realize that other than being attractive you have no interest in most of them. You also have to realize that people of the opposite sex talk to each other all the time when there isn't any romantic intent; subsequently this also means you shouldn't worry that if you start talking to some girl that she will 'out you' as wanting to date her. That shouldn't be a goal anyway if you haven't talked to her yet.

My advice is to start talking to girls as if you don't consider them a potential love interest. Assume it probably won't go anywhere and you probably wouldn't want it to anyway(both of which really are true). Talk to attractive girls just for the hell of it while telling yourself there is no potential. Good practice is to talk to girls where it can't go anywhere (like they're married) and then there's no pressure. Maybe you should pick out a girl who's married or you know is taken and sit by her and make casual conversation. I really think if most guys went in without the idea that they want to date the girl they wouldn't have a problem talking to her.

[...] My advice is to start talking to girls as if you don't consider them a potential love interest. Assume it probably won't go anywhere and you probably wouldn't want it to anyway(both of which really are true). Talk to attractive girls just for the hell of it while telling yourself there is no potential. Good practice is to talk to girls where it can't go anywhere (like they're married) and then there's no pressure. Maybe you should pick out a girl who's married or you know is taken and sit by her and make casual conversation. I really think if most guys went in without the idea that they want to date the girl they wouldn't have a problem talking to her.

I agree with this wholeheartedly. This is not only good practice, it helps demystify the people you'd otherwise hide from. It allows you to feel 'natural' in conversing (or even flirting) with everyone from old people to cocker spaniels, and this can only serve you over the course of your life--most especially when it counts.

My advice is to start talking to girls as if you don't consider them a potential love interest. Assume it probably won't go anywhere and you probably wouldn't want it to anyway(both of which really are true). Talk to attractive girls just for the hell of it while telling yourself there is no potential. Good practice is to talk to girls where it can't go anywhere (like they're married) and then there's no pressure. Maybe you should pick out a girl who's married or you know is taken and sit by her and make casual conversation. I really think if most guys went in without the idea that they want to date the girl they wouldn't have a problem talking to her.

I like this advice. And this is something that I realized a long time ago that I need to do. The barrier, I think, is my social anxiety, which inhibits my ability to effectively interact with people generally -- male and female -- but particularly with women I am attracted to.

Anyway, here's an update on those two girls:

(1) Haven't really seen her much; I think she started sitting somewhere else in class. Maybe I'll end up next to her again at some point, and I can say something. There are, of course, other women in the class, and if I end up next to any one of them, I could try to say something...

(2) The "poke war" went nowhere. I tried to "graduate" the poke war to messages, but she didn't respond. Oh well. Didn't really expect much out of this anyway.

And I guess I can add:

(3) A girl I volunteer with at the library. She is a bit older than me, which I like a lot because she's more mature than women my age, who tend to be immature and stupid. But this girl is intelligent and cultured; just my style. But I don't really see much potential there. Don't know why. Maybe she's too "above" me. But I think I can at least get some social practice off her.

(4) A girl on Facebook; I told her I was into her. She hasn't responded. Meh.

[...] The barrier, I think, is my social anxiety, which inhibits my ability to effectively interact with people generally -- male and female -- but particularly with women I am attracted to. [...]

This is the thing to address before you start counting every blip of interaction that doesn't lead you to a date as a failure. That's a zero sum game and the perfect way to burn yourself to a toast.

Perfectionists do this--they set themselves up to either climb Mount Everest in a single bound, or else walking of itself has no purpose. Either they 'win' a big prize, or they won't play. Either they can skate a perfect 10 routine without ever having to put on skates and do the work of practicing on real ice, or they'll just ruminate on their dislike for anything involving cold surfaces...

You're doing the same thing with social interaction, and then you're catering to the anxiety you create by doing that.

Stop measuring the potential value of any given interaction. By doing this, you'll only stop yourself from practicing on people who have no value to you. By not practicing, you develop no skills. Then you can't get what you want because you have no skills.

Start talking to people. Anyone. Everyone--babies, children, elderly, grocery store workers, the janitor, your parents and their friends, the person next to you in any class or situation. Don't consider outcomes, and don't measure anything except for the number of exchanges you attempt each day. Raise that number every day, and don't worry about anything else until you feel comfortable doing this.

Head high.

Start talking to people. Anyone. Everyone--babies, children, elderly, grocery store workers, the janitor, your parents and their friends, the person next to you in any class or situation. Don't consider outcomes, and don't measure anything except for the number of exchanges you attempt each day. Raise that number every day, and don't worry about anything else until you feel comfortable doing this.

 

Head high.

Thanks, catfeeder. Good advice. I've been trying to do this recently, although with little success. Just have to try harder.

Update on the above:

(4) Managed to get this girl's number. We talked on the phone for about an hour. She ultimately said she wasn't looking to date right now, since she'd gotten out of a rough relationship over a year ago and was just looking to stay single for now; I respected her honesty and forthrightness.

But one thing I noticed: It was nice just talking to her. I never get to interact with the opposite sex on that kind of level. Never. And it was nice to be able to for once. I really enjoyed our conversation --just talking about school and work and hobbies and the future. It was nice. Even though she's not looking to date right now, I enjoyed our conversation.

I feel somewhat encouraged now.

Thanks, catfeeder. Good advice. I've been trying to do this recently, although with little success. Just have to try harder. [...]

How, exactly, are you measuring "success"?

Millions of us just talk to people every day. No outcome, just some words. There's nothing all that measurable about it. The more we do it, the more we enjoy it. The less we do it, the harder it gets to resume the habit. So consider what you're trying to accomplish out of the effort and tell us what that is. We can tell you whether your expectations are reasonable or whether you're doing a perfectionist thing.

How, exactly, are you measuring "success"?

 

Millions of us just talk to people every day. No outcome, just some words. There's nothing all that measurable about it.

Sorry. I should have been more specific. I'm defining "success" as just doing what you describe: talking to random people. But I often end up just sitting there, silently. If that happens, I am unsuccessful, am I not?

The reason why this happens is, again, because of my social anxiety. When I see an opportunity to talk to someone, it's like there's something in the way and I can't. I begin to rehearse in my head over and over again about what I might say or do; and it become so much that eventually I figure it's easier to just mind my own business.

I need to break that habit. I'm a lot better than I was just a year ago; so I need to push further, step by step.

Update on the above:

(1) I've started noticing this girl more and more. Still haven't talked to her yet. Saw her again today, and thought I might say something, but didn't get the chance. I think the reason why I've noticed her is because she seems quiet and reserved, like me. I tend to be attracted to girls like that. Just don't know how to go about talking to her. I could sit next to her in class next time and just make an off-hand remark about the course material or something. We'll see.

Update:

(1) Okay, so I chickened out and ended up just sending her a message on Facebook yesterday afternoon. Stupid, I know. But I couldn't help it, so now it's done. She hasn't responded, and to be quite honest, I didn't really expect her to. Anyway, the message was simple; basically said: Hi. I think we have a class together. [class name] with [professor name]. Or something like that. Whatever.

I'm still proud of myself for smiling at all those women yesterday (see another thread). So that's something, I guess.

Well, so (1), (2), (3), and (4) all either faded away or didn't work out. So, I guess I'll add...

(5) A girl in a different class that I have. We recently worked together, along with two other students, for an in-class group assignment. She seems sweet. Thinking maybe I will try to talk to her again. I will try smiling at her as well, something which I would normally have anxiety about (smiling at someone I'm attracted to). Of course, as I explained in a different thread, smiling at women I'm attracted to is something I have recently made into a kind of mission.

Update:

(1) Not only did this girl not respond, but I think she blocked me (her profile is grayed out, so I can't click on it). After only sending her that one short message, she not only doesn't respond (which I don't mind) but blocks me too? Sheesh.

(5) Chickened out again, and sent this girl a message on our class discussion board internet page. No response.

Honestly, what the hell is wrong with people? Sort of just confirms what I've always suspected: When I talk to girls in real life, it often seems like they're just talking to me because they have to. But if I send them a message online, they don't have to respond, so they don't (if they know what I look like). Shallowness revealed.

Well, none of the others worked out. So, adding these two latest developments, which are of somewhat greater significance:

(6) On Friday I sent a friend request on Facebook to a girl I have a class with. We had a class together last semester as well, and we've talked in person only briefly a couple of times. Well, she accepted my friend request and we chatted for about twenty minutes. At the end of the chat, I suggested we get lunch or something. She said sure and gave me her number. I gave her mine and that was that.

(7) This one came totally out of the blue. Last night, at about 9pm, I got a message on OKCupid from a girl whom I hadn't talked to for a couple of weeks. She's one of the very few people who have actually responded to my messages on dating sites. Well, she never responded to my last message (about 2 weeks ago) and so I figured she wasn't interested and moved on. Well, last night, I got a message from her saying that she doesn't like OKC and is deleting her account, but wants to keep in touch with me and resume our conversation, and gives me her number.

Suggestions on how to proceed on both of these new developments would be very, very appreciated.

(7) She called me! And we just had an awesome conversation! We talked for well over an hour. There were a few slightly awkward pauses. She said she really wants to keep in touch with me and wants to see me if I'm ever in the area.

And that's where we get to the downside: I don't have a car. She doesn't have one either.

How could I possibly see her (she lives in a different city about 80 miles away)?

I guess we could keep talking on the phone, but how could we see each other and do stuff, like maybe a date?