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What is the point of marriage?


FreakAndUnique

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Sorry, I don't know.

 

My first thing that I wouldn't need or require the permission of the state to love someone. That should be a given.

 

And "commitment" - well, I think all relationships are based on "commitment" - but lets be honest, there are different kinds of commitment aren't there. Emotional and ... financial! Now we are getting somewhere.

 

The legal "commitment" is worthless. It can be broken for no reason whatsoever.

 

So ... what it is for? Financial protection for the female, nothing more, nothing less. Sorry.

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So ... what it is for? Financial protection for the female, nothing more, nothing less. Sorry.

If that's the case, (and assuming all men know this), then WHY is it that MEN still propose to their girlfriends? I would assume if men thought it was only for financial protection of their partner, they would run to the hills and NEVER ask them to get married in the first place. No?

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I feel the same way in some regards but I don't think my opinions on it are the same as yours. I think the most important thing is here how different the idea/definition of marriage is now compared to the past. Decades ago, marriage has always been a very defined thing that very few people would disagree about. Now, marriage to some is a lifelong religious commitment, to others a mere financial benefit. To others, they really don't know what marriage is to them - they just do it because it's what's expected.

 

Don't let the bitter couples out their spoil your idea of love! You're right, marriage, in it's most basic sense, really doesn't say anything about love at all. Whether we like it or not, "marriage" in the united states is a legal contract. Some choose to involve religious/personal ceremonies (and that is totally fine), but that is not what the word marriage means when it comes to law. You can love someone without marriage. You can also be in a marriage with no love.

 

Me, I would love to get married, but not because I feel I need it to be with someone for the rest of my life. I would just enjoy the benefits that come along with it. Do I intend to marry only one time? Yes, I would like to only spend my life with one person who I love. So in sum, I regard marriage is a legal technically, but love and committment are what matters to me...whether or not it is ever legally recognized is really out of my control (since I am gay).

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If that's the case, (and assuming all men know this), then WHY is it that MEN still propose to their girlfriends? I would assume if men thought it was only for financial protection of their partner, they would run to the hills and NEVER ask them to get married in the first place. No?

 

This is because, frankly, many men would do anything to please a woman, to the point of desperation. This is easier to see being a male.

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Ok, then..it's pretty simple:

 

Don't get married.

 

Be honest with your partners about your stance on marriage so they have enough information to make a decision for themselves about being with you.

 

Accept there are people who don't agree with you and who want to be married.

 

Follow those three steps and this becomes a non-issue pretty damn fast.

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This is because, frankly, many men would do anything to please a woman, to the point of desperation.

Then they only have themselves to blame (imo). If he's marrying "just to please her", then I have to say he deserves whatever he gets. It's not her fault. You'd think men are far more intelligent than that (at least I would hope so!).

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What benefits are these? I don't mean to be mean, I am just curious.

 

 

If you can't see the emotional and psychological benefits of marriage,that's fine, no one is forcing you to marry. I wouldn't have gotten married if all I cared about was being recognized by the state. And I don't need or desire "financial protection". The emotional/psychological benefits are personal and contextual in many cases, mine included. Hard to explain. I do know that taking my vows (we had a religious ceremony) was the most magical moment of my life (well giving birth was perhaps moreso) - it felt totally natural and right yet also magical and of course meaningful. My husband wasn't desperate to marry, we both wanted to be married to each other and we still do.

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If you can't see the emotional and psychological benefits of marriage,that's fine, no one is forcing you to marry. I wouldn't have gotten married if all I cared about was being recognized by the state. And I don't need or desire "financial protection". The emotional/psychological benefits are personal and contextual in many cases, mine included. Hard to explain. I do know that taking my vows (we had a religious ceremony) was the most magical moment of my life (well giving birth was perhaps moreso) - it felt totally natural and right yet also magical and of course meaningful. My husband wasn't desperate to marry, we both wanted to be married to each other and we still do.

 

Is it something to do with a public declaration? I could see that.

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What benefits are these? I don't mean to be mean, I am just curious.

 

1.)making legal/medical decisions in the event my spouse is incapacitated

2.)sharing my health benefits that I get from my occupation with my partner who is self-employed (currently we both have to have separate plans)

3.) same as #2 except for any adopted children I/we may have

4.) being able to cosign/sign legal documents with much more ease (look at documents for married couples vs just two friends - much more paperwork for the 2nd half)

5.) shared property taxes rather than filing for separate

 

Just to name a few. there really are a lot of nice benefits that come with marriage. I do not need them to remain with my long term partner... but they would definitely be nice They are all just conveniences though... luxuries... not something I can't do without.

 

But, I do know many people who never ever want or intend on getting married, and I don't think there is anything wrong with that. A lot of people nowadays have no plans to get married - it isn't really all that taboo anymore.

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Then they only have themselves to blame (imo). If he's marrying "just to please her", then I have to say he deserves whatever he gets. It's not her fault. You'd think men are far more intelligent than that (at least I would hope so!).

 

Wishful thinking. There is a saying where I live, "he has two brain cells, and they are both in his underpants". See, you are benefitting from my absolute honesty here.

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I do not need them to remain with my long term partner... but they would definitely be nice They are all just conveniences though... luxuries... not something I can't do without

So you see my point ... they seem to be linked to finance. But ... I will agree that there is some simplicity in being effectively "one person" when it comes to sharing stuff.

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There is a saying where I live, "he has two brain cells, and they are both in his underpants"..

lol, Well there ya go then. It's not exactly the woman's fault that he can't think further than what's in his underpants. If that's as far as they can use their "brain", then again I have to say, they only have themselves to blame.

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So you see my point ... they seem to be linked to finance. But ... I will agree that there is some simplicity in being effectively "one person" when it comes to sharing stuff.

 

I definitely don't disagree that some of it has to do with finance. But in your original post it wasn't just "finance" as a broad topic, but you said a very specific "financial security for her". No offense, but please don't try to say your point about financial security for her and my multiple reasons why marriage has perks as being the same concept. I 100% respect your thoughts - like I said, I can see many reasons why some people never marry or re-marry. To me this isn't a matter of right or wrong, it's all a matter of personal preference. However, I think you kind of hinted towards that with the second part of your statement, I think we are in the mindset of agreeing to disagree on some parts.

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So what is your opinion then?

 

Happily married for 8.5 years.

 

Kind of a shock, really...as I had absolutely no interest in getting or being married prior to my mid-30s.

 

Frankly, I'm not going to get drawn any further into this discussion. I've had similar discussions here and elsewhere on the topic. People who do not desire marriage for themselves (and I used to be one of them) simply won't get why others do...no matter how much those people attempt to explain themselves. They will pick apart every personally meaningful reason you give them and reduce it down to their reasons for not wanting to get married.

 

That's fine. You don't want to get married...that's your right to decide that for yourself. But that doesn't mean you have the right to declare the whole thing "meaningless" for everyone.

 

As for marriage being for the financial benefit/security of women. Thanks for the chuckle. I was my own financial security long before I met my husband, and during the majority of the time we've been married I've been the main breadwinner and carried most of the financial burdens.

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Sorry, I don't know.

 

My first thing that I wouldn't need or require the permission of the state to love someone. That should be a given.

 

And "commitment" - well, I think all relationships are based on "commitment" - but lets be honest, there are different kinds of commitment aren't there. Emotional and ... financial! Now we are getting somewhere.

 

The legal "commitment" is worthless. It can be broken for no reason whatsoever.

 

So ... what it is for? Financial protection for the female, nothing more, nothing less. Sorry.

 

There is some work suggesting that the public declaration of the extent of ones commitment to a relationship can be one of the factors that reinforces that commitment.

 

I would disagree that a legal commitment is worthless. It cannot be broken without various consequences that attach - some more severe than others.

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I 100% respect your thoughts - like I said, I can see many reasons why some people never marry or re-marry. To me this isn't a matter of right or wrong, it's all a matter of personal preference.

 

This maybe so, but lets be honest, many women just seem to want marriage full stop. Lets say my thoughts give me a distinct disadvantage ...

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And "commitment" - well, I think all relationships are based on "commitment"

 

It's about levels of commitment though. I used to think i didn't want to get married because I didn't see "the point" either. But then I met someone I wanted to commit to in a "forever" kind of way - and I wanted my life to be bound with his - and marriage provides both the social and legal framework to achieve that. I wanted to say I commit to him forever and I wanted to take on the social and legal ramification (and there are plenty of both) for breaking that commitment - it would be something that constantly reminded me why I'd made the commitment in the first place and how important to me it was. And yes, I do think we need reminders sometimes. And the fact that I was willing to do that (and him as well) should tell him (and me) something about how I feel about him and how deep my commitment is - something that words and actions and feelings by themselves cannot 100% be relied on to communicate in the same way that supplementing those things with the voluntary assumptions of negative consequences for the breach of your commitment can.

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Frankly, I'm not going to get drawn any further into this discussion. I've had similar discussions here and elsewhere on the topic. People who do not desire marriage for themselves (and I used to be one of them) simply won't get why others do...no matter how much those people attempt to explain themselves.

 

OK that's fine! But since you give no reason, I am still intrigued. If there was some sort of psychological/spiritual reason then that is fair enough.

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I don't really feel the need to convince the OP why I feel I am right; rather, I just like discussing the differing views of marriage. As someone who doesn't even have the option to marry in a legal sense, I guess I have always been interested in these discussions as long as they are open-minded, which I feel most of this has been (except a lot of sexism which is coming from both genders).

 

P.S. this response was just more of a "thinking out loud" thought - not a response to anyone.

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