Is she wanting her cake and eating it?

I’ve taken great help from the variety of posts on this website, and its comforting (in a sad way) to know that people have similar problems as my own. But would really like you thoughts / opinions on what to do next. The key thing to say is I love her, and I do want her back.

Brief backstory, been with my “gf” for18months, and enjoyed some amazing times together. However, the past two months she became non-responsive and distant, and would say “im ok” when I’d try to talk about the reasons why.

It came to ahead whilst on holiday and the general consensus was I had become too needy, planned my life around her and basically was suffocating her. She said I had become a non-entity to her, and all my social activities / hobbies had become based around her. Sadly in most part this was true. As I saw things going wrong, I tried extra hard to make it work, of which I now know pushed her further away. She worked most evenings, and all weekends, so I had to plan to see her, otherwise I wouldn’t. I’d go round hers at ungodly hours to stay round, even if I was up early for work.

My response to this chat was one desperation, the “I will change”, “what do you want me to do”, and crying in front of her asking why don’t u want me. It was pathetic, embarrassing and I’m genuinely ashamed of my response. I know now that this was completely wrong – which justified our decision to break up, for both our sakes. In most case this would be “just a break” – but you’re either with someone or not.

This was all 1 week ago, and this is where it gets confusing. She made it clear that she needed “time out”, and the physical aspect our relationship had gone. However, she continued to say how “im her rock” and “I wouldn’t know what I’d do without u”.

Im tried NIC – but I get messages every morning like nothings happened, acting like a couple. I try to distance my responses to not act as needy, which seems to only make her more interested (oddly empowering). We have been out for dinner and got on great, had coffee and generally acted as couple minus psychical contact, with no awkwardness or uneasiness. Its in that regard Im giving her space. She’s suggested I accompany her to an event, which I politely declined.

We get on brilliantly, and neither of us wants to go non-contact (even if EVERYONE I speak to is telling me to). I understand pulling away will make her realize what she’s losing, but Im not prepared to go cold turkey. We booked a weekend away for a mutual friends birthday (2 x 2 couples) as a surprise, in which we both intend to go. Its after this trip (2 weeks away) that ive set myself a deadline to see what to do next.

I've also made small changes (all be it in a week), i've got back the to the Gym and have been learning to cook.

Is she leading me on? Does she want her cake and eat it? Is she talking to me out of sympathy? Is she scared that if she doesn’t text me she’ll lose that safety net?

What should I do guys? The end of the day, I want to be with this girl.

In a word. Yes.

However, she continued to say how “im her rock” and “I wouldn’t know what I’d do without u”.

This says it all...she wants you on her terms only, to be her rock, not her boyfriend. I would distance yourself from her and let her find another rock...because you don't want to end up being used.

It's ok to do babysteps til you can really go full NC and let her know once u are ready to do it, that you need the time to get you back...(and take the "safety net" away totally-only you don't tell her this part).

I understand your reasoning...rather have something then nothing, but also know this...alot of people want to break up, want their space, want their freedom to date others and not feel guilty because they told you they didn't want strings, etc and so forth, BUT at the same token, they do not want to let you go for fear of "what if" I make a mistake and he has found someone else and moved on?

It is essentially having your cake and eating it too...by keeping you on the "string or hook", she can still test the waters elsewhere and come back to safe harbor when it doesn't go right...but what happens when it does? She'll drop you fully cos of new guy, and then you are left hurting even worse because you didn't do what you needed to truly heal.

Either way....your call. I hope for the best for you...at any rate, keep going, learning to cook, working out, seeing friends and def becoming more and more independent.

Your gut is telling you everything you need to hear. I was in a somewhat similar situation recently until I put my foot down. It freaked her out and she actually got upset because I called her out on her behavior. She was thinking I was such a "nice guy" I would just deal with it, but I don't roll that way. I told her exactly what was on my mind and she put on her best behavior for a few days, but went right back to playing games. The relationship ended there and I lost a lot of respect for her. I'm not great at advice, but I say if you really care and think this could be a long term loving relationship, tell her exactly how you feel and sit back. Continue to work on yourself and see how she reacts. Don't give an ultimatum. Right now she's taking you for granted and needs to see how her life would be without you. Just let her actions and your gut guide your decision.

Stand up for yourself.

End the relationship.

Go NC. If you asked her what you should do to make things work, and if she says nothing, that's a sign to end the relationship. My ex responded the same way.

I haven't talk to my for almost 4 months. Strict NC.

Thanks for you thoughts guys.

In my head walking away it may give her the shock she needs. But as much as I think this is what's best, I cant seem to do it. I know its pathetic, and i need to stand up to her.

EatPrayLove - I like the idea of "babysteps", and thats what im trying to do. Pull away. I've already noticed small changes with her, because im not texting back instantly (if at all), not offering to pay for dinner or having other things on instead of seeing her. I've started to taking that safety net away, and she has already started to struggle (which i hate to see as a care about her).

Sunman - I have that feeling in my gut that i should tell her how we are talking is not right. Similar to you, im "that nice guy" who will just deal with it. And although i am, i still want to be her BF. I have stopped reading into her flirty side notes, offers etc, when deep down i want to respond.

I dont think its a "take it or leave it decision" - nore would I propose this to her. How much can i "be there" for her, without ruining any chance of getting back together?

You can only do what is important for you. I know it's hard when she matters so much, but at some point you have to say exactly what's on your mind and play no games or you will stress yourself so much it affects your well being. You have no control over how she feels and that has to be accepted. I suggest telling her how you feel and that you want to be there for her, but it hurts and you're not happy with the situation. She realizes she can do what she wants with you and you will deal with it. Showing her that you care for her and at the same time respect yourself might shock her out of her routine. Show her that you don't NEED her, but you WANT her and will be fine on your own if it comes down to it.

I think i have come to "that" point now.

Over the weekend, i kept busy with work / gym / spending time with family and friends. She works Friday and Saturday nights, so i have always had the opportunity to go out etc. We have been getting on as we were as a couple (minus the physical aspect), but told myself to start pulling away. She seemed off when i said i didnt want to come round for dinner before heading out. Later in the evening, whilst not having a particularly great time, she offered to come and pick me up from my night out. Luckily, i had already arranged a cab. I say luckily, as with a few drinks in me, the offer was extremely tempting - just to see her.

Anyway, all this apparent good work was wasted yesterday. Having spent another day apart, contact via occasional text msg, she suggested coming round hers for a spot of TV. Baring in mind she lives at home, i was greeted at the door with her in her comfy PJs and dressing gown. She was to do some uni work whilst together, but proceeded up to her bedroom. Now we usually watch TV in her room as she likes her privacy away from her family, but i was shocked when she had already set my a place up - in her bed. She even offered my PJs as it was more comfortable. Like a mug, i accepted. We watched TV, looked through her work commitments, did some work, and generally had a chilled evening - the type a couple has on Sundays. It comes to 11:30pm, and while both in bed, she makes the comment of "oh - are you staying tonight then!!?" - I go on the defensive asking wasn't it what she was suggesting? She said it was fine, but left me in complete confusion. I'd add it was anything to do with sex on my part, or the suggestion of it, but just that she wanted to spend the night with me.

So here i am this morning, feeling like i've been duped. She seems to want everything a boyfriend has to offer, without the desire for anything physical. It's starting to play with my head a little. She made a suggestion about having my friends round for bonfire night, fireworks bbq and the like - and said we'd do it together. WHAT!!?

Why is she suggesting to spend evenings with "My" friends, knowing that we are broken up? Is there any meaning behind it to wanting to be couple? she is struggling to juggle her work, and has been calling me "boss" as im helping her out with organising. MUG.

Whats the best way of discussing the situation without completely ruining any chance of becoming an intimate couple again?

It's starting to play with my head a little.

Stop. Red Flag. Get out. You are making progress. This will only stifle your progress. She wants all the benefits of a boyfriend, without the commitment. That's using you as an emotional tampon. You are not her boyfriend anymore, you shouldn't need to sit around and deal with her problems. If you are so hardset on hanging out with her, then make it more sparse. If I were you, I'd instantly reject the offer of the BBQ, say you have plans already.

You HAVE to pull back. She will never realize what she's missing if you constantly fulfill her emotional needs. Pull back, be busy for a couple of weeks until that weekend getaway thing. I think it's the perfect opportunity to see whether or not she's changed her attitude. Although to be honest, it's not enough time for her to realize this. Stop being there for her, be busy with your own life, and have her feel your absence a little.

Sound advice, and i thank you for it.

It's weird what the difference a single event can have on your entire outlook. That Sunday made me realise what people on here, friends, family have been telling me to do is the right way to go. Actually, it was signing up for a chartable run / army assault course with a few friends which have given me a new focus. Plus, when selecting my charity, made me realise that there are things going on that are more pressing to worry about than "what does my gf mean by that". Its not hte way to be.

also stumbling accross CrapatNC's has been of huge benefit - justreading the number of people that have a similar issues to my own, how they dealt with it, and even their success stories, has made me look at my situation completely differently.

Hope now is to concentrate on me. I will still be in contact with her, but on my own terms - and it will be relaxed and playful. Pulling back is the answer - not completely, but enough to know what she's missing.

All those things combined have given me a completely different take on things.

Man, every time I get down I reread the first few pages of Crap's thread. I love it, and I'm making some progress. It's not for everyone, but it is for me, and you too. Best of luck, and keep us updated.

I agree - It may not bring my gf back, but at least if it doesnt il be in a better place! Don't get me wrong, I want my relationship back, and hope that this new outlook will help. Iv re read craps original post multiple times to remind me that it will be come good either way.

Il keep u updated, and I hope that results are positive. But I don't care either way! Haha

So a week on from stumbling over this thread - and my new found nonchalance attitude, this is where im at.

This weekend I went away with friends to the coast, having been talking to the "ex" all week and not mentioning it! She seemed a bit put out that i'd gone, and was texting more than usual - asking how it was / what i was doing, and more importantly when i was back on Sunday. "Fancy a night round mine?". I brushed it off to say depends when i get back, its a long drive.

Didn't hear much from her on Sunday, she was working all day. I wasn't too fussed, but I'll admit i missed the interaction. I didn't hear anything until mid evening, but it was oddly apologetic - the reason for her lack of contact was that her phone hadn't been working. I no this to be true because its my old iPhone, and had a tendency to block out any incoming calls or texts whilst perceiving to work fine. She was quick to offer an invitation, which i accepted.

Similar to the Sunday before, greeted at the door in PJs. However, not wanting to make the same mistakes as last week, I went straight to the living room to watch TV. We chattered, joked and laughed, she did some Uni work on the floor whilst i sprawled on the Sofa. She then made (which for me sounded like an excuse to move) a point of saying she was cold, and joined me on the Sofa with a blanked (all be it on opposite sides). I shrugged this off. She complainned her feet were cold, and wriggled them closer to me. I playfully rubbed them.... she ended up, intentionally or not, playing footsy. I laughed saying "feet still cold?", and got a smile in response.

After the show finished, I abruptly said i was going. She agreed and said she was headed off to bed soon anyway. Went for the door and she was forthcoming to offer a kiss on the cheek. Previously even this was too much. I said "i'll speak to you later", in which she replied "i'll text you in a minute!".

Sure enough as i walked through the door, a msg arrived - something random about printing her work off. We texted for a while, and she even said "thanks for coming over". She was tired so said she was going to sleep, said she'd text in the morning, apologised that she was going to sleep, and gave me three "xxx". I left a short "Night x" reply and thought that was it. An almost instant response came back asking if i was Grumpy! I said not at all, and what gave her that impression? - the short response apparently! I said i thought you'd have dosed off! Ended up saying going to sleep - and left a lot more "warming" good night!

As a side note - we are still "in a relationship" on Facebook, and a picture of me and her on holiday is the background on her phone.

What you guys think of her behaviour / actions? Am i reading too much into these texts?

It felt good to leave on my own terms, and also that she thought i had a problem when leaving a short response to a good night msg. Its the weekend away on Friday, which im looking forward to. I think there were some positives signs over the weekend, but not sure. Is making the first move this weekend right if the opportunity presents itself?

Wow! Nice nonchalance / pulling back! My hat is off to you!

I would say things are looking good for you, because she's clearly still wanting you around at least and--most importantly--it was neediness that pushed her away before, and that's clearly becoming a thing of the past for you.

Don't read anything into anything. Just keep being the new you. Be good to her but good to you too, and just don't be so available (which you've been doing brilliantly).

If you truly believe in nonchalance and pulling back, I say let her make the first move. As long as you stay as cool (not cold) as you are, keep things fun as you have, and in no way have any expectation/need, then I think she'll let you know that you have aroused something in her.

Make sure you keep rejections playful. When things are going the way you want--STOP! Yes, stop. If you start making out, quickly stop like nothing happened and suggest a coffee or something. It works. It shows you have no agenda, no needs, and oodles of confidence. Feel free to kick things off again when you've had (or while you're having) coffee. Two steps forward, one step back. It's tantalizing. Play with her. Make her want you. This is for HER. We never appreciate what's handed to us on a plate, and always find ourselves drawn to the seemingly unavailable.

Remember: if nothing happens, that's FINE. You have NO expectations other than to spend time together. Have a playful smile on your face throughout. Pretend you don't want her to try anything. "OK, you can jump under the covers with me but none of that footsie stuff to try and get me turned on; I'm not that easy."

Enjoy your weekend. I expect to hear how you maintained playful nonchalance throughout. We all envy you. Have a good time for all of us. We're rooting for ya! ;-)

Thanks Crap - your pools of wisdom seem to have worked a charm thus far! Although I know im not there yet, and appreciate your continued advice, I hope to give an update before i leave!

I'll go with no expectations. If we actually get to the point of making out - im gonna have to keep in my head on not to get carried away. I like the idea of her making the 1st move. Obviously i hope she does but im not expecting it (nor be disappointed if it doesnt) - she usually initiates intimacy anyway so this shouldn't be anything new. That's why I wasn't sure if i should throw her the curve ball and make the first move...

Atta boy! This sounds just like Crap's stories, you're becoming a guru Keep up the attitude, DON'T SLIP! Chances are now she's so intrigued she'll probably test you more. Keep your emotions under control, you got this !

askltk - you are the man. You are doing SO well, particularly this soon after the break up. Keep it up You will find it will ultiimately make you a more chilled and desirable person in so many areas of your life. Win win!! It took me 4 months to get where you are!!! x

Thanks Kate - Glad to see things are progressing with you as well! (seeing Craps fourm).

Dont get me wrong, there have been a few faint signs from her, but if i've learnt anything since the break up (and the subsequent week of non') is not to read too much into ANYTHING! Positive or negative. I admit i used to almost obsess about alternative meanings to the most standard of texts, or check my phone every 2 minutes for a reply.

I am no where near there yet, nor do i think I am at a point where my ex wants to come back. But it's more positive at least. If you've read this thread, you'll know this is "THE" weekend, and although i dont want it to sound like its make or break, the success of it will ultimately determine what happens afterwards!

But, im trying to learn not to care either way! Ha

Update - the day after "the weekend before" (i apologise now, this may be a long one).

As this thread has stated, things between me and my ex have been "improving" (for much of a better word recently), so i was looking forward to our weekend away with another "couple". It had been scheduled before the break up, and because we got on so well, it was never in contention that we wouldnt go.

The day before we were due to leave, we'd text alot, all happy excited messages about going away. As i was at work, she bought me all my "travel toiletries" (without me even asking), and even got excited as she bought me a winter hat (again nothing suggested by me!) as we were going on city break which would be cold. I was grateful, of course, and secretly pleased. But i didn't read too much into it.

I stayed round the night before, as it was easier for lifts in the morning (we had to be at the airport for 6am). We packed together, watched a DVD and planned what we wanted to do over the weekend. All pleasant stuff.

The morning we headed to the airport to surprise her friend (it was for her 21st, and we'd secretly been planning the trip with her BF). Luckily, they knew and understood our situation, so there was no uncomfortable moments - we got on as a group of 4, rather than separate into two. We sat in '2s' on the plane for ease, and that was all fine.

We got to city destination in plenty of time, and joked around taking pictures and doing the bus tour. Again, me and the ex spent alot of time walking around together, enjoying each others company. I continued to act confident / nonchalant, happy to go with the flow of the day, but at the same time making suggestions. My ex did warm to this, even tho she is quite "controlling" in those sorts of situations. There was no physical signs of affection at that point tho.

We got to our apartment, and it was 2 double rooms, which was fine. There is no shame or embarrassment between us, so quite often she'd come in and id warm her up with a towel. and visa versa. She acted like my gf, just once again without really coming forward with anything more physical. It was all playful flirting, but nothing more. She condoned it, but i knew that she wasn't going to be forthcoming with anything else (by that i mean a cuddle or kiss etc).. so i wasn't going to make any move. There were a few opportunities where i could have made a move, but my better judgement stopped me.

That night we headed out, went for dinner and drinks, and generally had a good night on the town. The streets were cobbled, and apparently that plays havoc with a girls heels (!), so she openly locked arms with me as we walked. Similarly on the way home, and a few drinks inside us, she clung on to me. I didnt make any comment, just carried on walking and read nothing into it. Once we got off the cobbles, she continued to hold onto me for the duration of the walk home. Once home we got ready for bed infront of each other (down to undies) and went to bed. We talked about stuff, not me and her, just general chit chat before going to sleep on opposite sides of the bed. I didnt expect anything more to be honest.

Second day was very similar, if anything a bit more flirty. She locked arms whilst we walked, poked fun at one another and laughed. She sat on my lap when there was a shortage of space, but no emotional intent was there, she just sat down! Ha The whole nonchalant approach was working, although there was a couple of times where she suggested a different route home than where i was taking, thinking I was leading us the wrong way. Usually i would have let it slide and apologised (she's quite opinionated and has to be right), but I laughed it off and told her to go that way. Ended up she was wrong, and although she didnt omit it - we laughed about it, held hands and took a picture together on a nice bridge. Weird. Again we went out for the evening, to a really rubbish place if im honest (the girls pick, not mine), which put a dampener on the whole evening. We ate late, were all tired and sober, and called it early one. Bed time was the same as before - i lent over to kiss her on the forehead to say night, but that was it.

From a personal standpoint, I wouldn't have done much else differently, I acted how i wanted. Im not devastated that there was no romance there, although i would have liked her to make that move. We had a great weekend!

Anyway on dropping her off, she gave me a quick kiss on the cheek and said she'd speak to me soon. I knew that I'd hear from her again that day, as that how she was. Within 20mins, I got a message, thanking me for the weekend, and asked if i fancied a roast dinner at hers with her sister and BF! I accepted as my evening would have consisted of cheese on toast! She seemed quite pleased to see me, and we ate dinner chatting.

She received from her friend who we went away with, and took the call out of the room. I wasn't concerned or bothered, but her conversation was still comfortably in ear shot. Inadvertently, she apologised to her friend for her bad mood and our argument - and subsequently said "its just when after a break up there always there they get on your nerves a bit...!". Now, i wasnt sure how i should take it, but i just thought id brush over it, not mention it, and just make my exit. She had lots of university work to be doing after having the weekend off, so I suggested I go. She said she didnt mind if I stayed but would be working in her study - I just said im gonna go. Another kiss on the cheek, another "il speak to you in a bit", and I left. On getting in, I get a text from her, regarding nothing but "holidays are coming" - the advert was on TV and she loved the build up to Christmas. A nothing msg really. I responded nonchalantly, and she kept replying but with no real reason to. In the end she sensed my lack of witty responses was because i was tired, so she said good night.

So thats pretty much it. I sit here now pondering my next move, and seeking your advice. I always said i would re-evaluate after our trip. Had it been difficult / uneasy i would be going NC now. Because i didnt expect any romance, I didnt get any. Am i disappointed... a bit, i wont lie. But i think by not making move I showed her i didnt need her. She's text already this morning, the same as before.

Is it time to initiate NC? While things are ok between us, do I leave it as it is? Im under no illusions, I dont think she'll change her mind at the drop of a hat. But its Nonchalance has helped alot over the past 2 weeks - maybe keep working on that and see where it leads? Answer on postcard.....or via quick reply! Ha

Before I write my opinion, is it just me or is there a part of the story missing before that "phone call" in which she said "getting on her nerves"

I've re-read it like 3 times and either you omitted something or I shouldn't be on ENA at 5am hahah.

PS, cheese on toast = GRILLED CHEESE BABY hahaha

Ha grilled cheese is the same thing isnt it?

No nothing missing - she took the call just after dinner. What do u think is missing?

Yeah, I thought the same as MakeItCount: in her phone call, she mentions an argument; what was that about?

Re. NC: no, don't. Not yet. You're doing fine with your nonchalant approach.

Re. what she said in that call (or to anyone else), ignore it; my ex would say all manner of things to her friends, none of which, it turns out, she meant. They say things to protect themselves, their reputations, their hearts should things not work out.

I think it's time to kick things up a notch. Have some dates. ;-)

Sorry chaps - didnt really explain it very well. There was no argument as such, it was the disagreement about the walk home. She was insisting i was wrong - and usually id back down. But this time i didnt, and it ended up she was. I didnt gloat or anything, just brushed it off. But she's on of these girls that like to be right all the time. It put her in a bit of a mood for a bit - which she was referring to.

I like the sound of paragraph 3. Is that really what its like with some girls!? I will ignore it, it wasn't for my ears anyway. I think this is the case to. She is protecting herself. Funny, as we have a mutual friend who has mentioned a couple of incidents where the stories differ (see my Post number 9 in the thread - she saw this as me assuming...hhmm) - again i'll ignore it. Do you think it's a sign of her trying to be perceived as doing better than it is? to make it look like im chasing her?

I also agree with not starting NC - and glad you still see im doing ok with Nonchalant approach!

Pondering the Date idea - need to get out and meet some first! Ha

Thanks again for contribution - needed your insight today!

I don't mean to be harsh on you bro, but you broke most of the cardinal rules of breakup.... It comes down to this; you must take back the power that you have given to her (and so much of which it sounds like). If you keep on empowering her, playing into her, keeping up contact with her, then the co-op you call a 'rship' will stagnate, it will not get any better, in fact it will fail and it will fail rather quickly. You've got to abide by the no contact rule and let her take notice that you are not devestated by her leaving, you are taking your life back and making it better: WITHOUT HER, do you get me? It's by doing this she will notice a new aspect about you, and she'll most likely find it appealing. Trust the voices on this forum bro, do what you got to do and stop coddling her.