Is taking off a childs clothes to spank sexual abuse.

I know this subject may make some readers uncomfortable. It is not my intention to step on any toes. I realize many people still spank their children in this day and age and I'm betting many do not. I'm also guessing that there are those who do pull down a child's underwear and spank the bared buttocks of their child. I'm not judging anyone. I am concerned though that spanking a child's bared body may be considered sexual . I myself was spanked many times as a youngster from 7 to 11 and I had all of my clothes removed for the punishment.I was then placed over the caretakers lap and repeatedly smacked with an open hand for what I would say was 2 or 3 minutes. I would like to ask....do you think that a child ,wearing no clothing, laying on an adults unclothed lap and spanked would be considered a sexual. I realize it was very common in the "good old days" but attitudes are changing. Do any parents still practice this, what are your thoughts? A child of 11 can have sexual reactions when spanked this way and this is not just something that I read.

When you say laying on an adults unclothed lap what do you mean?

I had all of my clothes removed for the punishment.I was then placed over the caretakers lap and repeatedly smacked with an open hand for what I would say was 2 or 3 minutes.

weird.

wrong.

not normal.

not sexual, but it's something a psychologist would have an absolute field day over! 3 minutes?! are you kidding me?!

there's no need to remove a child's pants to spank them unless the aim is to purposefully intend sustained physical harm. GBH anyone?

My own moral judgement and every fibre in my bones after doing child protection training tells me that yes this is sexual abuse. Degradation, subjugation and humilation of this type is child abuse in any case, whether it is sexual or not.

I'm not sure what you mean by "sexual reactions"...

What I do know, though, is that spanking is very degrading.

If you add in the nakedness, the element of shame is increased.

When one is taught that such violence is deserved, and 'for their own good', they begin to learn to accept harm as an appropriate display of love.

So, it seems to me that people who as children are subjected to violence by those that they love and trust as that more susceptible to becoming adults that either feel that it's okay to hurt those that we care about, or adults that see any harm done to them as acceptable, deserved, or in extremes-- violence as an expression of love.

This leaves such people that much more inclined towards romantic or sexual relationships which are defined by power plays; whether it be in a controlled way, such as S&M, or in an undeniably healthy way, such as in abusive relationships.

Teaching a lesson such as this to a child is abuse of someone who is most vulnerable to it, and who will in many cases feel the sting long after the original sin has been forgotten.

I think 7 to 11 is far too old of an age to be spanked.

It is also far too old of an age to be forced to take all your clothes off.

I don't know if this is "sexual". That really depends on the intention of the spanker.

However, I do agree that this can lead to long term psychological problems with the child. Such as, not feeling comfortable with taking your clothes off. As being naked was a punishment.

I don't find anything wrong with spanking (though 7-11 is a little too old), but I don't understand why the clothes have to come off.

More kids could use a spanking in this day and age.

An adults unclothed lap refers to the adult wearing shorts thus having bare legs. An unclothed lap also refers to the lap of an adult that is wearing a skirt or dress and purposely pulls the skirt or dress in towards themself before placing the child on top of that JUST bared lap. This can also occur if the adult is wearing night clothes as in a nightie. This leaves the naked body of the child(including genitals) in direct contact with that adults skin(lap).

I don't think that would be sexual abuse, but it really depends on the adult's intentions. I'm not sure why that person would pull their skirt/dress in towards themselves.. be it an unconcious move or because they get "turned on" by the child touching their skin. I think it depends on the adult's other behaviors and if they are also questionable. If the extent of the adult's wierdness is naked spankings and did not involve the child naked at other inappropriate times nor touching the child, I wouldn't necessarily call it sexual abuse.

Just because the child is naked does not equate sexual abuse. For example, you would never consider a parent washing their naked toddler in the tub abuse just because the kid is naked.

But in this case, 11 years old is WAY to old for a spanking, much less a naked one. I could see this being a humiliation technique, which could be considered abuse, though may not be sexual abuse. Doing that to an 11 year old is definitely not okay.

Spanking as a short sharp shock can be effective, and is generally acceptable - spanking for three minutes is just... excessive, IMO.

As far as smacking a naked child on a naked(or partially) adult's lap, it may not be sexual abuse, but the fact remains that I would find it necessary to question as to why the adult was naked.

sounds reallly sick. sounds like the parent has serious psychological problems.

i was spanked as a child...... never naked... but always with spoons and belts. i still remember every time and i refuse to spank my kids because it was extremely abusive. i cant imagine someone making a child remove their clothes on top of it. Sick!!!

I'm a new mom (he is 4 months old!) and I remember being spanked once, not hard, over my mom's lap when I was 4 years old - she didn't want to but I'd done something bad repeatedly. She felt like she "had to" - i remember this. I also remember feeling punished but not in an abused way at all. I don't think I would spank my child - I might swat him on the bottom with my hand, once (not hard) as in "stop" (not until he would understand what that meant - certainly not now or soon!) but I guess that's not "spanking".

What you described sounds like abuse whether sexual or otherwise.

Well, just to provide a counterpoint, exposing the bottom leads to a sharper smack, which means that you don't have to hit as hard to get the same effect, something which I would say is a good thing (I would never smack with anything but my hand, ftr).

Not sure if that's what the OP was talking about or not.

Yes, this makes me uncomfortable on a couple of levels. Personally, I'm not a fan of spanking. As the others have stated, three minutes of striking is abuse no matter how you cut it.

Why do people associate spanking with abuse? Spanking is NOT abuse. Spanking is a form of discipline that kids NEED. NO I don't agree with taking a child pants off to spank, that's overkill, but swatting a childs rear three or four times is NOT "abuse". I was spanked and will spank my own children if I need to. It's annoying hearing a parent yelling at their kid constantly to do or NOT do something. Kids don't listen to words, they react to actions and consequences.

Yes, this makes me uncomfortable on a couple of levels. Personally, I'm not a fan of spanking. As the others have stated, three minutes of striking is abuse no matter how you cut it.

I would keep in mind that there are levels of "abuse", and that 2-3 minutes of spanking (not excessive force) could only be considered very mild, since people seem to turn on outrage mode whenever certain words enter a conversation...

 

As far as smacking a naked child on a naked(or partially) adult's lap, it may not be sexual abuse, but the fact remains that I would find it necessary to question as to why the adult was naked.

OP said the adult wasn't actually completely naked, but would have bare legs. And if the adult was wearing a skirt or dress, they would pull it up so the child would be lying directly on the adult's bare legs. Not sure why they would do that either.

I feel that spanking is borderline abuse.

It's teaching kids to respond to hits rather than words.

At 11...which is 6th or 7th grade, btw....a kid shouldn't be hit by a parent.

Why do people associate spanking with abuse? Spanking is NOT abuse. Spanking is a form of discipline that kids NEED. NO I don't agree with taking a child pants off to spank, that's overkill, but swatting a childs rear three or four times is NOT "abuse". I was spanked and will spank my own children if I need to. It's annoying hearing a parent yelling at their kid constantly to do or NOT do something. Kids don't listen to words, they react to actions and consequences.

Yes but the actions don't need to be physical -- the actions can be taking the toy away or putting the child in a time out place. And in school when I taught we weren't allowed to spank or hit (of course not - and I am glad for that) so if the parents did that at home it made our job that much harder because we had to teach the kids to behave based on words plus actions that were not hitting or similar.

No need to yell at a child - you go over to the child and speak to the child at their level (i.e. bend down if needed) and if that doesn't work then you remove the child from the situation or remove the toy or thing with which they are misbehaving. What you wrote is exactly the problem with spanking - you draw the line at removing the clothes but what happens when your three or four swats stop working because the child gets used to it - do you escalate it to 6 times? 10 times? If you do things the way I suggested there is no need to escalate because the consequence is specifically related to the individual situation and the child learns that way. JMHO.

Thats pure wickedness, and people shouldnt not practice that any more, and for some people yes it is sexual abuse.

My own moral judgement and every fibre in my bones after doing child protection training tells me that yes this is sexual abuse. Degradation, subjugation and humilation of this type is child abuse in any case, whether it is sexual or not.

I agree with you Batya.I am talking about situations where nothing else works. I don't think kids need to be spanked in every situation, but sometimes they do like when your mom saw it as her last straw with you...because NOTHING else worked to get you to listen to her. Kids test their parents constantLY and yes sometimes they NEED to be spanked. And today is not like it used to be. Sending little Johnny to his room is probably EXACTLY what he wants...No parents to bug him, he has his Play Station, his phone, his TV...WOW...some "punishment".

OP said the adult wasn't actually completely naked, but would have bare legs. And if the adult was wearing a skirt or dress, they would pull it up so the child would be lying directly on the adult's bare legs. Not sure why they would do that either.

The question still remains. My point is that "unclothed lap" could mean anything from hoiked-up dress to full nudity from waist-down. Needs clarification.

I feel that spanking is borderline abuse.

 

It's teaching kids to respond to hits rather than words.

 

At 11...which is 6th or 7th grade, btw....a kid shouldn't be hit by a parent.

You're assuming that kids are logical and reasonable and before a certain age, they simply aren't, especially in today's society.

Obviously by 11 they should be close enough there. BTW, wouldn't grade 7 be 13yo?

Thats pure wickedness, and people shouldnt not practice that any more, and for some people yes it is sexual abuse.

No, locking your daughter in a basement and keeping her pregnant a la Fritzl is pure wickedness.

Try to keep a little perspective here, eh?

Why do people associate spanking with abuse? Spanking is NOT abuse. Spanking is a form of discipline that kids NEED. NO I don't agree with taking a child pants off to spank, that's overkill, but swatting a childs rear three or four times is NOT "abuse". I was spanked and will spank my own children if I need to. It's annoying hearing a parent yelling at their kid constantly to do or NOT do something. Kids don't listen to words, they react to actions and consequences.

In many cases, I don't think spanking is considered abuse if a parent uses it sparingly with the intention to teach the child to stop doing a specific behavior. However, with some people it can cross over and become a parent's tool to relieve their own frustration rather than to actually teach the child something. And in this case, the OP said it lasted "a good 2 or 3 minutes". You will end up with a whole lot more than 3 or 4 swats in that much time. And the OP was up to 11 by the time it stopped. That is WAAAY too old. Spanking is for toddlers, not kids nearly old enough for junior high school.

I was a freshmen in high school when I was 13.

I think that you should give children more credit.

My two sisters have never been spanked in their lives. They are both very good children (but they weren't always).

As for me, I've been spanked once. On christmas, by my father. I don't even remember what I was spanked for. I remember it being very traumatic though.