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Thread: Questioning NC

  1. #11
    Silver Member TomboyMS's Avatar
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    Wow. Great post. Thanks!

  2. #12
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    "It is amazing how an ex can get you to pursue them and they don't even know they are doing it -- when you do pursue them, they reject you and feel even more certain of their decision. They get you to pursue, but then they reject you again and again.."

    Dear Mr.SoandSo2009,

    I want to say that you post should be read everyday twice by all ENA members on this getting back forum It is the only way to get your ex back--if there is even a small possibility of getting them back. As a dumper, this is precisely what I did and felt when I dumped my steady boyfriend. If a dumpee doesn't understand this, then it is a waste of months, years.

  3. #13
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    Originally Posted by Siberia
    -- when you do pursue them, they reject you and feel even more certain of their decision. [/B]
    Dear MrSoandSo2009 and Siberia,

    Why does pursuing make dumpers ever more CERTAIN of their decision?

    I mean, I know that it makes them feel secured and avoid emptiness. But please explain why it makes them more certain of their decision --ditching you?

    I am the kind who has more motivation/strength to do the right thing if I am given good reasons and explanation. I trust your wisdom without question...but the more I understand everything, the easier it is for me to feel that I WANT to stay away rather than having to FORCE myself to stay away

    Don't get tired of me just yet please

  4. #14
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    Thanks MrSoandSo, i think that was an excellent post that made a lot of sense, one of the best i've read in recent days...

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  6. #15
    Bronze Member MrSoAndSo2009's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=kitchty;3277705]Dear MrSoandSo2009 and Siberia,

    Why does pursuing make dumpers ever more CERTAIN of their decision?

    I mean, I know that it makes them feel secured and avoid emptiness. But please explain why it makes them more certain of their decision --ditching you?

    I am the kind who has more motivation/strength to do the right thing if I am given good reasons and explanation. I trust your wisdom without question...but the more I understand everything, the easier it is for me to feel that I WANT to stay away rather than having to FORCE myself to stay away

    Don't get tired of me just yet please

    There are various possible reasons just as there are various possible scenarios. Typically, though, the dumper has made a difficult decision that has been weighing on his mind for a long time. He may or may not have been aware of this consciously, but you can be sure that subconsciously something was in the works for a while. This is the detachment process that most dumpees don't recognize is happening in their partner because they are too emotionally involved. This detachment process is a powerful defense mechanism, and when the break-up finally happens, the dumpee is often shocked and suddenly behaves in desperation.

    This desperation is like negotiating with death -- it's a fight to live: "I want to live! I want to live!" But, the dumper has his mind set and rarely is able to change on the spot. It takes time, space, and distance for the perceived "threat" (see next paragraph) to be reevaluated.

    The key words are "defense" and "threat." So, there is a threat (i.e. something that could cause pain) to the personality. On the surface, the dumper's behaviour may seem irrational, but at a subconscious level of awareness, the most reasonable course of action is to protect the personality from possible pain using whatever resources are at its disposal (i.e. defense mechanisms -- anger, avoidance, inappropriate laughter, denial, and on and on).

    The dumper himself may not even have a very good understanding of why he behaves the way he does in the aftermath of a break-up, but his actions will demonstrate to you a manifestation of that powerful defense mechanism that essentially sees the dumpee as a threat. Pay attention to ACTIONS more so than words if you want to be able to recognize how the dumper is engaging in a kind of defensive behaviour (shutting down, tuning out, creating distance instead of closeness).

    When they hold onto you as a friend, that usually means that some part of the dumper is not ready to completely let you go, because the dumper does not want to face to full brunt of his pain since most of his energy is being spent in avoiding that pain or emptiness. This is very painful and confusing for the dumpee, who will then engage in a kind of process to justify holding onto the friendship and who will tend to put the dumper up on a pedestal. Although the dumper may want to hold onto the dumpee, it is just to avoid the full consequences of his decision, and the dumpee ends up being abandoned. Of course, sometimes a friendship can develop, but most of the time, this doesn't happen in the aftermath of the break-up.

    Some dumpers, who are experienced, will attempt to explain to you what went wrong, and will try to have closure in a caring way, and they will let you know that it will take a long time before you can be friends and that you should remain out of contact. This is a healthier way to break up with somebody.

    Sometimes dumpers are totally cold and just want you to go away. Whenever you bring up the relationship, you simply remind him of the pain he is trying to avoid. I've been in that situation myself. I pursued an ex one time and she got angry and said to me something very insightful:

    You can talk about anything with me, but not the relationship. Whenever you mention the relationship, it forces me to think about it and causes me pain, and then I just want to run away from you."

    The rest of time, she was completely able to NOT think about it, which, for me, was amazing at the time. "Out of sight, out of mind." She also saw no reason why we couldn't remain friends. What an ordeal that was!

    Of course, I was not as clever then as I am now, and I made all the mistakes that everyone else makes

    Another way to look at it is this: when you hunt for explanations, or try to be around the dumper, or when you bring up the relationship, or when you pursue him, you are completely disrespecting what he has asked for -- that he wants to be single and free again -- and you are fighting an uphill battle against his defense mechanisms, which are waging a war that you can't overcome with any amount of logic or reasoning. To win that battle, that kind of CHANGE requires something much deeper or more personal then what you can achieve by having a conversation during the turmoil of a break-up.

    (DISCLAIMER: I'm not a professional -- make your own judgment!)


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    A very good analysis Mrsoandso. Dumpers do perceive dumpees as a threat, because dumpees want to pull them back to a painful corner they are desperately to leave. The decission to leave is never out of the blue, though it may seem so sometimes. Dumpers have been thinking about breaking up, even subconsciously, for a long time. They may have made a series of unsuccessful attempts at breaking-up in the past, but reconciled each time due to dumpee's tears and their own fears. But each unsuccessful break-up only strengthened their desire to eventually get away--when the time is right from them i.e when they feel strong enough.

    Once they announce the break-up, all the past pain of relationship and long preparation of breaking up swells up in their mind. They are almost intoxicated by an intense desire to break free. From now on, anything the dumpee says or does is a hindrance to their goal of breaking free. All sweet gestures, gifts, conciliatory talks, tears, pleads--all are hindrances to their goal of break-up. The feel dumpee is deliberately planting obstacles in dumper's path of flight.

    Talking about relationship during break-up is physically painful to dumpers. I have been there. When I dumped my ex (4.5 years ago) a thick curtain fell down in my mind. My mind went ABSOLUTELY blank when thinking about my relationship, and it was a very deep and serious relationship. It was almost as if I was biologically incapable of thinking coherently about the relationship. A dense fog would cover my thoughts and trying to see through it was impossible. I really think it was a biological defense mechanism, and even at a gunpoint I wouldn't have talked about the relationship. The mental fatigue about the past was unbelievably overwhelming. I perceived everything my ex said or did as an attack on my decission.

    In this situation, if the dumpees pursue, woe be to them They are not only pushing the dumper away, they are ruining their chances of reconciliation. Now is the time to let the dumper meet his goal--that of dumping and leaving. If we don't cooperate, the dumpers will leave with more vehemeance. If we cooperate, they will still leave, but will remember that we respected their decission. The key thing is to agree gently, without passive aggressive behavior. That means, not being sarcastic, not yelling, not abusing, not asking them to go to hell, etc

  8. #17
    Bronze Member twomonks's Avatar
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    So Siberia,

    Did you go back to your ex in the end?

  9. #18
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    I very much wanted to..but I got into another relationship and didn't want to hurt the second person. So I stuck with the second person even though I wanted to reconcile with my ex much after the break-up. It was more a matter of principle for me to not dump my rebound and I was determined to not let my second bf down.

    Now my second bf has dumped me. After 4.5 years of being together.

    This is life.

  10. #19
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    hey mrSoandSo....

    You don't need to be a professional to give good advice. I am really glad you are here!!!!

  11. #20
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    Originally Posted by Siberia
    Talking about relationship during break-up is physically painful to dumpers. I have been there. When I dumped my ex (4.5 years ago) a thick curtain fell down in my mind. My mind went ABSOLUTELY blank when thinking about my relationship, and it was a very deep and serious relationship. It was almost as if I was biologically incapable of thinking coherently about the relationship. A dense fog would cover my thoughts and trying to see through it was impossible. I really think it was a biological defense mechanism, and even at a gunpoint I wouldn't have talked about the relationship. The mental fatigue about the past was unbelievably overwhelming. I perceived everything my ex said or did as an attack on my decission.
    Hey, were you aware that you were not thinking clearly and were floundering in the fog at that point in time? Or did you strongly believe that your decision was rational, that you were all cool and calm unless the dumpee is around stressing you out, that you were really doing these out of your will rather than any defense mechanism, and that you didn't want to talk about it not because of the fog/pain but because it is in the past, you want to move forward and don't want to go back there so there is no point talking about it?

    I guess I am after my ex's words too much and maybe I really should just look at actions. Seriously....whenever the relationship subject was brought up he really looked like he was in physical pain that is caused by something greater than just "wanting to move forward, we are not together any more so there is no point talking about it"

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