You make the call...justifiable violence or not?

I'm allergic to dog hairs and have had severe reactions to hairs in the past. This park i go to and train in to do windsprints sometimes has a group of dog people that walk their dogs off the leash, and sometimes a dog will run up to you and jump on my leg. Usually its a small dog and I turn my back to it and yell to the owner, "I'm allergic to dog hairs come get your dog."

Well the other night a German Shepard looking dog, maybe about 80-100lbs starts coming up to me with no owner in sight. Well I freaked out a bit, became filled with rage and did whats called an ax kick (where you get foot high in the air and then drive the heel straight down) into the dogs head. The dogs head kind of bounced off the ground, it starts letting out this loud whimper, and all the dog owners, followed by a pack of dogs start coming over. For a second there i thought WW3 was going to break out. The dog laid on the ground for a long time with the owner ranting and raving kneeling over it. (I guess there is no ambulance to call for dogs). Another dog owner helped take the dog into a car.

To make a long story short the police arrived and decided not to arrest me but took my info. The fact that they were even questioning me as if i did something wrong surprised me. The park is in New York City, on the boarder of Queens and Long Island and there seemed to be some confusion by the responding cops as to whether the dog should've been on a leash or not which again, i found surprising. The dog owners made some odd claim that after 9pm its legal to walk your dog off the leash.

I was just sick and tired of being jumped on by dogs and worrying about the hairs. In the past i noticed some owners seemed to get a rise out of working their dogs off the leash when it seemed to intimidate the non-dog park people.

Am i a total a-hole or was this justifiable?

Well the dog didn't ATTACK you so what you did was pretty out of line. I don't know whether they can make a charge of animal cruelty stick but they might try.

There are lots of alternatives you had like pushing the dog away, leaving, avoiding the dog, etc. Your life wasn't in danger so causing such a severe injury to the dog was way out of line.

I do feel some guilt. A dog whimpering that loud really is tough to hear. But i feel the dog owners are bullying the non-dog people out of the park.

Whether they are bullying or not is irrelevant. You kicked the dog, not the owner. The dog has no idea that he is supposed to be on a leash, that he is not supposed to run to you, or that you are allergic. Basically, he suffered for the perceived sins of his owner. Would you think that was fair if you heard this story?

But that is not the dog's fault. The dog suffered a lot of pain at your hand and didn't do anything to deserve it.

The dog owner was responsible, not the dog. You attacked an innocent dog. It was not trying to hurt you and you caused it harm. Its likely they will get a citation for the dog being off the leash (there are many places that do have relaxed leash laws at night, so they could be in the right entirely).

Being allergic to dogs is not an excuse for the act you committed.

The ASPCA is not going to be light.

They shouldn't be, you did a horrible thing.

Well, I would've liked to kick the owner but i don't want to get locked up. I mean really, you can't just let a dog run around without a leash in public thats that big. The way I'm rationalizing this for now is that its at least partly the owners fault.

You can do lots of things to keep dogs off of you. A easy one "NO". Yell it at the dog.

Being allergic to dogs does not give you the right to be cruel to them.

I don't think anyone is arguing with you that the dog probably should have been leashed. But then you take action against the owner either by calling the police or taking a civil court action for jeapordizing your health.

But beating on the dog was completely uncalled for.

Well, I was actually surprised my kick did that much damage. Like i said i feel bad for the dog. I mean its not like i'm Michael Vick or something. Yikes guilt is creeping in...

Was this at a dog park?

Was this at a dog park?

No. There are parks in NYC that have "dog runs" where the dog people can let the dogs run around but the area is fenced in within the park. This park is kind of on the outskirts of NYC and is more neglected than most parks.

People, this was an unleashed German Shepherd that came at him in the dark, not a beagle or something. These dogs were bred for violence, genetically speaking they can take a hit.

Entropy, in my opinion you overreated a little maybe, but it freaked you out and it sounds like you did it on almost reflex. I could see people laying a guilt trip if you'd paused and thought: "How best can I hurt this dog that's bugging me?", but it was instinctual. Big Dog-lover's have to learn to understand that their pets are the descendants of wolves and other violent ancestors, and that their animals can take and deal out damage.

edit: specified - big dog lovers, as in owners of Rotties and Shepherds.

An apology to the dog owner and offering to take care of any medical bills incurred for the dog would be a nice way to get rid of that guilt.

An apology to the dog owner and offering to take care of any medical bills incurred for the dog would be a nice way to get rid of that guilt.

I can't do that because i don't want to make any admissions of guilt that could make me legally susceptable...too bad i can't apologize to the dog. I have no sympathy/empathy for the owner however.

He never said he was afraid of getting bitten. He said he was worried about getting hairs on him because he is allergic.

Also, I'm curious- if the owner is only partly to blame, who else is to blame? The dog?

I am not a huge dog-lover either way. I like animals, but I live in nyc, too, and I see the people with their dogs off leash. It's illegal and annoying, but not an excuse to kick the animal or the owner. There are very few instances in life that violence is justifiable.

People, this was an unleashed German Shepherd that came at him in the dark, not a beagle or something. These dogs were bred for violence, genetically speaking they can take a hit.

I had a german shepherd for years, she never bit me. Had a beagle, it bit me. German Shepherds are not bred for violence, they were bred for sheep herding and intelligence. They can be TAUGHT violence, which is what seems to be forgotten.

Dude, as a serious dog lover and owner. Don't ever do that again unless your being attacked. A GSD is not a breed to mess around with and you should consider yourself lucky that it didnt turn on you. Im not singling out GSD's here btw. Hell I have the sweetest lab in the world, if you kicked it the way you described it probably would have wanted to bite you too. Its just self defence. Breed specific is useless.

I know you've received enough guilt from the forum, but if I was that owner I probably would have kicked your face in after seeing that. No offense.

Its not right man. Like everyone said, the dog doesnt know its not suppose to be offleash, or that your allergic or anything like that. For all you know it wanted a pat on the head and a smile.

If your allergic to dogs and you frequently see people walking their dogs, onleash or not, why do you even go there? Why dont you just find a different park?

He never said he was afraid of getting bitten. He said he was worried about getting hairs on him because he is allergic.

 

Also, I'm curious- if the owner is only partly to blame, who else is to blame? The dog?

 

I am not a huge dog-lover either way. I like animals, but I live in nyc, too, and I see the people with their dogs off leash. It's illegal and annoying, but not an excuse to kick the animal or the owner. There are very few instances in life that violence is justifiable.

Well, perhaps I overreacted, so i'd say i'm partly blame. I'm sure the karma police will get me soon enough, they always do when i react like this...but i'm certainly not going to fall on my sword, say i'm the bad guy come take my freedom and my $.

If your allergic to dogs and you frequently see people walking their dogs, onleash or not, why do you even go there? Why dont you just find a different park?

With all due respect, I'm not getting bullied out of a park i was practically raised in. Sicillians don't run. Its just who i am.

How allergic could you be? I have pretty severe dog and cat allergies, but a cat on my leg doesn't kill me. I avoid sitting in a room with a cat on my lap and I get stuffy, sneeze a lot, and my skin itches if I'm in a house with cats. I would never attack a cat!

Unless you feared for your safety, hurting the dog was cruel and uncalled for. If you're at a park with an on-leash rule you have a right to be annoyed when people have their dogs off-leash, but there are other ways to deal with your frustrations. You could wait for the owner to come to the dog and talk to the owner, you could even file a complaint, if dog people are bullying dogless people I'm sure you could get a petition together to have the park enforce the on-leash rules, ect.

If you have some rare very serious allergy to dogs (by the way, it isn't the hair people are allergic to, but the dander) you should avoid places filled with dogs and go to the gym instead. My opinion - no you were not justified in attacking an animal that didn't threaten you. Your issue was with the owner.

Lets not get racist here buddy. For all you know the owner of the dog you kicked was from another region or not even Italian at all lol. BTW im Sicilian Try not to be so stereotypical

But honestly, your one person, there's 100s if not 1000s of dog owners in NY. Chances are if theres a park in the neighborhood that tend to have people with their dogs off-leash, its going to attract more and more dog owners. And your defense is you grew up there? Why bother with the hassle man? And don't think I'm against you completely, some of these dog parks are extremely unsafe. Sometimes the wrong owner who thinks their dog is ok with people and other dogs ends up being completely wrong and ends up tearing apart another dog or child.

Why risk it if you don't even have a dog? I don't see why all that is worth it. Its bound to happen again. You seem to have a short temper with animals, or dogs at least.

With all due respect, I'm not getting bullied out of a park i was practically raised in. Sicillians don't run. Its just who i am.

Unforunately, you have a condition that you need to make accommodations for. Your allergies could care less if you were raised in that park. That is life. We make compromises. So your choices are to either go the legal route to try to get the leash law enforced, find somewhere else to exercise, or go at a time when they are not there. That's it. Fighting them on your own is just going to get you arrested.

Lets not get racist here buddy. For all you know the owner of the dog you kicked was from another region or not even Italian at all lol. BTW im Sicilian Try not to be so stereotypical

Fair enough. But i believe it is socially acceptable to stereotype if you belong to that race

Why risk it if you don't even have a dog? I don't see why all that is worth it. Its bound to happen again. You seem to have a short temper with animals, or dogs at least.

My problem is more with homo sapiens than dogs. My answer again is i won't be bullied. I don't know how my "rare" my allergy is but my friends golden retriever once brushed me by and i was miserable for 3 days.

Unforunately, you have a condition that you need to make accommodations for. .

Yea, that condition is i'm not going to be bullied out of a park i grew up in.