redswim30

You can't change what happened. Like you said, all you can do is move forward and try to apply what lessons you have learned from it. IMVHO, and some people may disagree, but if you already know you aren't in love with you wife and know that any "efforts" you make are going to be half hearted on your part, then there's really no point going through those motions and giving your wife a sense of false hope where there really isn't any. I actually think if you already know where your feelings lie and you don't see them changing, then you should be honest with both yourself and with her that it is over. It does no one ANY good to pretend to "make the effort" if you already know your heart isn't in it. IMVHO, to do so would actually be cruel to your wife to pretend you are invested when you really aren't. Let me tell you in all honesty as someone who was married to someone who kept giving me false hope that he was interested in "fixing things" when he really WASN'T- the emotionally yo-yoing he put me through was MUCH worse than if he had just been honest with me about wanting a divorce in the first place. We ended up divorcing anyways, but now besides just being heartbroken, I also felt deceived and that he had wasted my time. It's likely your wife is either in denial about your true feelings OR (and this happens more often that you may think) she may KNOW but cares more about keeping you there as a husband and father figure than worrying about true closeness. For some people, that's enough. However, you aren't obligated to stay in a romantically loveless marriage to make someone else comfortable. I think it's time to be totally honest and let go of the security blanket. Do this after you have a safe place to go to and have gathered information. But I think it's going to be necessary to have a real and tough conversation with your wife. You need to tell her how unhappy and unfulfilled you are romantically and that you had an ongoing affair. This may snap her into reality about how serious your issues are. She may want to divorce you for that alone. (No matter what she has said in in the past, you never know until you are IN that situation how you will really feel). Or she may decide that a friendship marriage is enough for her. But you will never know until you face the music. You also need to consider what you really want deep down. I know divorce is scary. I've been there. But honestly, you are already emotionally divorced from her. She should get to have a say in how she really feels about that and how she wants to proceed- with full disclosure from you. Then you can both make an informed decision together. I hope for your sake she is truly interested a non-messy divorce.

Sometimes working on a marriage can resolve issues but only if both parties all fully invested. IMVHO, it likely didn't work because the truth is that deep down you are just not in love with your wife (you already know this) and don't really want to be married to her. You want her friendship and for her to think well of you and serve as your buffer for not being alone. This is why the idea of divorce felt fine to you when you thought you could have another person filling your voids, but now without that backup, you are scared. I get it. Being alone can be scary. But the truth is you are already alone, even if you still live in the same house as your wife. We all have to confront our inner issues alone, whether are are married, dating someone or single. No other person can fix problems inside us. I'm glad you said you are getting into therapy, as I think this will help give you clarity and start you on a good path towards healing. IMVHO, you are never going to be the best version of yourself or be the best partner you can be until you start resolving your own issues. Please face facts that you are no longer in love with your wife. You are staying with her out of fear, complacency and comfort. If you were madly in love with her or truly deeply wanted your marriage to work, you wouldn't have sought (and kept) and affair and even offered to get a divorce for her. Please divorce her so she can be free to find someone who really wants her as a spouse and not just as a friend/security blanket. You are already just friends with your wife, so why not make it official and do the truly loving thing by letting her go to find someone that really wants her. Only after you work on your own personal traumas and healing will you really be able to see if you want or can be a good partner to another person. Facing trauma and working towards healing are scary things. But this is a journey you should take alone.

Why is it you were willing to divorce your wife when this over woman was in the picture, but now that she is gone you are reluctant? This suggests that you don't really care about staying married to your wife, you are just afraid of being alone. You need to get divorced as you are no longer in love with your wife and clearly only interested in staying with her for financial reasons and possibly for your child. Please re-read your post. Please take note that there is no mention of you trying to work through issues with your wife. Everything you mention about your wife is really about you. Nowhere do you say you love your wife and don't want to hurt her. You express more worry for yourself and about this other woman, than you do for your wife and child. That should really tell you everything. Your heart and mind are not on your marriage. You don't really care about your marriage nor are you invested in saving it. If you are no longer in love with your wife and stood ready to divorce her for someone you were having an affair with, then you do NOT have "everything you need". Staying in a loveless marriage in which you are cheating on your wife and offering to leave her for another woman IS extremely selfish. Divorcing your wife would be the honest and right thing to do. If you remain emotionally unhappy and can't connect with your wife, you will only continue to cheat on her. Please do not stay with her out of complacency or fear. Do not stay in this marriage because you have a nice house and child. I doubt your wife signed up for a "marriage" in which her husband stays with her for the nice house and for friendship while he goes off and has love affairs that he is willing to leave her for. You can't take back the past but you can control your present and future. Please divorce your wife. She doesn't deserve to be your consolation friendship relationship if the romantic one with your girlfriend doesn't work out, so that you can look like a good guy and remain in your nice house.

Your family is already being impacted by this, whether you see it or not. You are already on the route to divorce, whether you see it or not. Kids are smarter than you think. You are currently modeling for your daughter a blueprint for how she will view relationships and marriage. Your Girlfriend not wanting to marry you or give up independence does not mean she has not or will not form any emotional attachment to you or at some point feel possessive of you. If your wife really IS your best friend- then as best friends you should admit that you are in not love with each other anymore. (Loving someone as a person is not the same as being IN LOVE with them). Many people who divorce still have love for each other, but cannot live with severe incompatibility. You have severe incompatibility as spouses, even if you are compatible as friends. You need to tell her the FULL truth and let her decide if she wants to stay in a sham/friendship marriage or get a divorce so you can both be with people who you are both more compatible with. And so your child has a healthy example. You are risking more than you think- you know your GF's kids COULD say something to your kid, right? If they haven't already- " You know your Dad comes to our mom's house all the time?" It's VERY easy with the internet and social media for kids to communicate without grownups knowing. If nothing else, you should think about protecting your child. Kids hear stuff thru the grapevine all the time these days. You and your wife are lying to each other and avoiding telling each other the truth about your feelings- divorce is inevitable. This is not in any way a happy or healthy marriage. You either need to step up and admit it now or it will come out later in a much worse- and likely unexpected way. This sham marriage is not sustainable.

Divorces do not have to be messy and terrible. Many people are in fact BETTER parents when they can focus on parenting as opposed to their struggling marriage. I'd argue that sometimes divorces are better for children than having two struggling parents that live together as roommates. You may love your wife and she may love you, but you are clearly not IN LOVE with each other anymore. You said it yourself, she feels like a sister and she is definitely treating you as a sibling or friend as well, not as a spouse. If you did not have a child, would you consider a divorce? IMVHO, staying in a marriage ONLY for the kids is usually a bad idea and for more toxic for the child that parents even realize. You SAY you wife was fine with having an "open marriage", but I'm wondering if she truly knows you look on her as a sister. And that this other woman is NOT just an "affair partner or mistress", you are softening this for both her and yourself- this woman is your GIRLFRIEND- Please stop lying to yourself about this. You are married with a girlfriend which is not fair to either woman, and I don't think you wife really fully realizes this. Your GF might be fine with this for now, but I'm doubting she will be forever. You need to face facts about this before things get really messy. You need to sit down and have a frank conversation with your wife. You may be married on paper, but neither of you is really behaving as though you are married. You with your girlfriend and her not caring about intimacy with you at all. You should have a real conversation about this, "I need to be honest with you about how I am feeling. No matter what happens, I want to focus on raising our child together. However, I no longer feel romantic feelings for you, and I feel like you have also checked out of the marriage romantically. I am feeling like we are more like siblings or friends than spouses. If you do not want to divorce under any circumstances, then we need to be open about how we are honestly feeling about each other instead of ignoring it. I have a girlfriend. She is not just a casual sex partner. If you are okay with me keeping a girlfriend who can meet my needs that you cannot, then perhaps we can work out staying married. Or if you are not okay with this, then perhaps we should discuss separating and continuing to be good parents to our child. Divorce is an option, and we can maintain a good relationship if it comes to this." You need to have this conversation, because this is what you aren't saying to each other. You are both avoiding reality. If you do not have this conversation by choice, it WILL happen eventually under more heated circumstances. Ironically by not bringing up the possibility of divorce, you are almost ensuring you will HAVE a messy one if you continue to ignore and sweep reality under the rug in the long term. Having your cake and eating it too will only last for so long.

It sounds like your wife is emotionally selfish. You clearly vented your heart out to her. Her response is friendly, but not supportive or holding a strong desire to help you work through all these feelings. First thing is first, please see someone about your depression. It will only be helpful to you, no matter what is going on within your marriage. Sorry you got rejected from the job. But remember, it's just one job. There will be more. You and your wife need to sit down and talk about things. While it's not her job to "fix" your depression. It IS her job to be supportive and to be as emotionally open and available to you as you seem to be towards her. It's interesting that she says you complain too much, but it also sounds like when you express anything less than pleasant emotions, her response is to shut down. No wonder you feel emotionally alone, it's because you ARE. You are basically in a no win emotional situation with her. She doesn't want to hear complaining, yet when you are fair and vulnerable she shuts down. You do not have healthy communication here. I would strongly recommend getting into couples therapy. You both need some help defining your emotional needs. Marriage takes two and you BOTH need to be fully invested in creating change and improvements. If you both aren't in this, your marriage will only continue to deteriorate little by little, until it reaches a boiling point and one (or both) of you can't take it anymore and separate. Take it from me, your marriage is on a bad path. NOW is the time to try and correct it, not brush it under the rug just hoping things will get better. Honesty and therapy time.

He's not in the wrong, YOU are. There was and is NO cheating going on here. You broke up. He made it VERY clear how he felt about you, and that he had no intention of getting back together with you. It's not his fault you were in denial about his honesty. You asking him to stay was a mistake. You expected that you could manipulate him into wanting you again, and when that didn't happen- you got mad. You are being unreasonable. He's under no obligation to like you back just because you still have feelings for him, that's your problem- not his. You have no right to feel betrayed. He did nothing wrong. He was honest with you. You just didn't want to believe it. You thought if you continued to "play house" everything would just work out the way you wanted it to, that he would read your mind, and change his, all without ever having a conversation about your own feelings and desires. You are the one that was lying to yourself and to him. If he has feelings for someone else and he knows you still have feelings for him, then moving out was the right thing for him to do. This is actually honorable of him. I understand you are upset because he hurt your feelings and your ego. But you were already broken up and he made his feelings and intentions clear to you. Move on and let go. Breakups hurt. You are just coming out of your denial that he no longer wants to be a relationship with you. It has hurt your feelings and your pride. But none of that is his fault or problem.

In my experience as a woman, YES- most women are insecure/worried about talking too much around someone they like. Why? Because we are often silenced, shushed, told to minimize ourselves, told we're "obnoxious" if we talk too much. Honestly, my own husband "shushed" me the other day. When I was single, I would often apologize for talking too much, worried a man wouldn't like me if I did. Even with close friends, I sometimes do this. Part of it is just cultural for all the reasons I mentioned above. Part of it is nerves, I talk more when I really like someone- so, I'd take this as a strong sign that she likes you!

Please read this over and over- almost exactly what I was going to say. Intimacy is much more than just sex, and you have been extremely patient, understanding and accommodating. It's another thing altogether to not want to demonstrate any kind of affection to your partner. That is actually being cruel. It's unreasonable to expect you to treat your wife like a platonic friend, when that is not the marriage you signed up for. Just remember, you can't be in marriage of one. You are willing to meet her halfway, she has to be willing to come the other half or this will never work. Your wife is holding onto some secret she doesn't wish to share. What that is, I don't know. This is much more than just physical to her, she is making the choice to actively push you away and even daring you to leave her. IMVHO, people only do this for a few reasons- 1. They are just done with the relationship, but instead of being honest, push the other person to break up with them under the guise of "You deserve better than me" 2. They have someone else waiting in the wings 3. Worst of all, they want to change the dynamic completely without caring how you feel about it None of these is great. What Lost said is accurate. Please don't beat your brains out thinking there's some magical thing you can do or say to change her mind or mindset. There isn't. This is NOT going to be cured with "date nights". If I were you, I'd consult a lawyer. Your marriage is on a fast track to Divorceland. Only AFTER you have your ducks in a row, it's up to you if you want to make one honest and last ditch effort with her to attempt to save the marriage. But your wife has to be willing to be honest with you, and she is NOT being fully honest with you. She's hiding behind an operation THREE YEARS AGO, but do not let her manipulate your compassion. Operations don't prevent someone from wanting to cuddle or hug. Operations don't make your wife call you SELFISH for wanting some level of physical (non sexual) level of closeness with her. She may still have some love for you, but that is not how someone who is IN LOVE with you acts. I agree with you, OP_ she's not in love with you anymore. Stop trying to compromise with her, don't try and get her to therapy- because none of that is going to work as long as she refuses to be HONEST with you. Something (besides the operation 3 years ago) has changed for her EMOTIONALLY. But instead of telling you and trying to work thru it with you, she's calling you selfish and daring you to leave if you don't "like it". This isn't going to be healthy for either of you in the long term. Time to face the facts. Your wife wants to dictate a new marriage to you totally on her terms. You need to decide if you want to live as friends for the rest of your life, because that is what she seems to want. If not, consult a lawyer. Only after you have things figure out, if you think it's worth it, you can ask her if she's willing to tell you the truth and meet you halfway. But I think you already know the answer to that.

I'm sorry to tell you, this man is not in love with you. He's saying ALL the classic lines to try and get you to break up with him: 1. "Incapable of change"- this is BS. Everyone is capable of change. Not saying it's not HARD and easier for some than others. But, to take this stance is being absolutist- what he's really saying " I don't care enough to change for YOU." 2. "The relationship isn't fair to you/you deserve someone better"- The "nice" breakup phrases. People pull these lines as bait to get the person to break up with them and still looking "good" in the eyes of others. 3. "He's not the right man for you"- OP. how much more obvious can he GET here? 4. "He imagines his life without you." This says it ALL. No one who WANTS to be with you imagines life without you. Let me put it to you this way- I often imagined a future without my ex. I have never imagined a future without my current husband. Because if we're really in love with someone, we can't picture a future without them in it. 5. And the coup de grace- "He doesn't "know" if he wants your relationship to work." Translation- he's not in love with you. Someone saying they don't know how they feel about you or your relationship is often just code for "I KNOW I don't love you/want you, but I don't want to hurt your feelings, so I'll be vague with saying I don't know" but the I don't know says it ALL. I'm sorry, OP. But stop wasting your time with a man who clearly isn't invested in you or a future with you. You may not want to break up, but he DOES. Why do you want someone so badly who feels so lukewarm about you? I know it's hard when we love someone. But we cannot force someone to feel the same way about us as we do about them. I can't tell you if he has another Lady waiting in the wings or not, but I CAN tell you, he doesn't see himself with you long term. It's true that no relationship is perfect, OP. BUT, there's a big difference between having minor disagreements and making large sweeping statements about not being with you, not feeling in love with you, and not picturing a future with you. Please stop investing time and energy in a man who so clearly doesn't want you. There's better men out there. Men that will treat you well and WANT a future with you. Or even men who don't want a future with you, but show you the decency and respect to break up with you if they don't. What your BF is doing is spectacularly terrible. You really want a future with a man who gaslights you, manipulates you, some would say is emotionally abusing you, and doesn't love you? You can DO better. Please break up with this jerk. Give him what he wants and find a better quality person, you deserve it. If you insist on staying with him, expect him to keep putting you thru emotional torture til you can't take it anymore and break up with him. Your BF is coward. He wants to break up, but instead of just doing it, he wants to try and get YOU to do it for him through subtle manipulation to make himself look like a better person. If you don't break up, this will turn to bigger manipulation. And could even possibly veer into abusive if he's had enough.

You're welcome. It's your first major relationship, so a large part of this is going to be a learning process for you. We learn a lot about ourselves when we are in committed relationships. And you are right, sometimes what we learn surprises us. Especially by way of our own flaws, issues, and how our past has shaped us to believe and feel things. Acknowledging your issues is the first step to improving them. I'm proud of you for admitting and accepting your own issues. It's important to remember this for this and future relationships- NO partner can fix the issues within us. No man will ever be able to fix your insecurity for you and other women are always going to exist in the world. Being aware and okay with that is a journey that you have to do yourself. All the time I witness people who self-sabotage relationships because they LOOK for things to justify and validate their beliefs or insecurities, whether they are actually true or not. (IE I'm afraid he's going to cheat on/leave me- so I'm going to read into every single interaction that could possibly validate that belief, even though he's given me no solid reason to not actually trust him) I highly recommend you take two actions as soon as you can. First, communicate with him about what you would like in your relationship. But approach it from a positive and non-accusatory place. For example, " I think it's so great that you have awesome and supportive friends. I genuinely like them and enjoy hanging out with them. But, if you and I are planning to hang out together since our time is always limited, I would like to ask you if in the future we could please have a conversation before inviting friends to join us. It would really mean a lot to me and would make me feel like you value my feelings and input about how we manage our time together." And see how that goes. Second, put yourself out there more. Do more things without him. This will go a long way to not only building your self esteem, but to see yourself as valuable person worthy of love, respect, and attention from people other than your boyfriend. Significant others should never be our only valuable relationships. You hit the nail on the head. Everything WILL be all right. 🙂 You just need to approach things from a positive and proactive place. You're still very young and have a lot of time to explore what is, live in the moment. I can tell you as a woman that has done and seen a lot in my life, please don't ever waste your time on what COULD be. Try to see and appreciate what is your life now. Life and relationships often don't go quite as we expect them to, but that doesn't mean things can't be beautiful. Learn to let go of what isn't meant for you and embrace the positive you do have. All the best to you.

I'm sorry to tell you- I think it would be wise of you to dump her. She doesn't sound like a sweet person at all. She sounds like a selfish liar who cared more about her own ego in that moment, by her own admission "didn't remember you existed"?, did it MULTIPLE times (not once) and then lied about it and tried to make herself seem like the victim. Does that really sound like a "sweet" person to you? More than her cheating is the fact that she didn't tell you the truth, until she felt guilty enough to do so. I think it's really telling of her immaturity, her selfishness and how dishonest she is that her first response was to deny responsibility and try to make it seem like she was "forced" into kissing this guy, multiple times. Is this really the type of person you want to spend your life with? Do you have low self esteem? The real red flag here is her response to everything which is more worrisome than pretending you don't exist (which is still pretty bad) because she was attracted to someone else. Sorry but IMVHO, she is still lying to you about "not enjoying it", that's to try and spare your feelings. Generally speaking, I (and most women) wouldn't kiss someone twice that I didn't enjoy kissing the first time. IMVHO, ONE kiss would have been a mistake. TWO kisses is a CHOICE. Please don't lie to yourself about that. If she hated the first one (or cared about being loyal to you), she would have stopped the second one. If you stay with her, I strongly believe that even if she never cheats on you again (which I personally think she is likely to), how will you ever trust her? Is she always going to lie to get herself out of making herself look bad? Think about yourself- if the two of you have a bad fight, is she going to deny any culpability and place all the blame on you? You say honesty is important to you, so do you really want to be in a relationship with someone who continuously lies to you? Love isn't enough when it comes to compatibility. I think you aren't compatible in this area of honesty. Stay with her if you want to, and you seem to want to, but don't be shocked when this happens again. "When someone shows you who they really are, believe them the first time." Look, I don't think she's the world's worst person, but even if you wanted to really reach and chalk this up to a "one time mistake" she STILL sounds exceptionally selfish, immature and her gut instinct is to lie to make herself look better. Is that really what you want in a long term partner?

You say this is your first serious relationship, so I'm going to give you some advice as someone in her second marriage. You say you are ok with being friends with people of the opposite sex, but are you? Really think about this. You haven't and will not have met every single woman he's ever been friends with in his life and you won't necessarily (highly unlikely) to meet every single female he ever interacts with- be it a colleague, a past friend, or even someone he once flirted with. I always advise people to tread lightly here. Remember that your BF isn't a possession, and it's actually not healthy to want to be (and I'm not saying YOU are, but things can take this turn if you aren't careful) the only person of the opposite gender he cares about on any level. Think about yourself- do you feel the need to "report" to him about every interaction you've ever had with any male ever? I'd dive deep here into what really bothers you about this. You are RIGHT in that you DO need to be able to trust each other. We live in a co-ed world, he's going to interact with other women all the time. I personally believe men that are capable of having platonic female friends are less likely to cheat than men who simply view women as romantic interests and nothing more. If you feel the need to have a conversation about your feelings, make sure you are expressing how you feel without accusation and with the understanding that any agreement you make or parameters you set can and will be held to you in an opposite circumstance. You say he has poor communication, but it doesn't sound like you are the greatest at it either by your own admission. So, I would first examine yourself. Remember, he's not a mind reader. If you don't express your needs, you cannot hold him accountable for invisible expectations. Now onto my advice for you- It sounds like you need to sit down and have an honest, open, and calm conversation in which you express your needs to him. But please understand, he may not fully agree with it. This is where it turns into a real and adult conversation. It's not like in the movies, where someone says what they want and their partner immediately sees their POV and does it. You can expect some level of pushback or even upset, and then you see if you can reach a compromise. But rarely in life, does a partner actually say " Yes, dear. Anything you say, dear." So do not go in expecting that to be the outcome. Can I ask what you are so upset about? Your problems seem very typical for a young couple and nothing outrageous or even bad. Your BF isn't even technically doing anything wrong at all. I think perhaps it would be wise for you to seek individual therapy. I wonder if there's some underlying issues going on with you that this relationship is trudging up for you. Perhaps you aren't ready to be in a serious committed relationship? Please understand I do NOT mean that as an insult in any way. But I do need to comment to you- ANY person you are ever going to be in a relationship with- You cannot control everything they do. It's up to you to state your feeling and expectations and then see if you can reach a compromise. But no one is ever going to be a mind reader, and that's unreasonable on your part. I think you really need to take your BF out of the equation and dig deep into what the source of this hurt is for you. You mention feeling alone. Could it potentially be that you feel some resentment towards your BF for having multiple sources of support while you feel like you only have HIM? I don't know, but I think it's worth you thinking about and consulting an unbiased expert.

So you slept with someone else and "just realized" you had an affair? Most people would consider sleeping with someone else an affair. If it was just emotional, it would be more understandable. You bonded over losing this woman that you both loved deeply. However, the question is once it became physical, why didn't you stop it after a kiss? That would have been the time to recognize that a line has been crossed. Sorry to say, unless you think no one in your family will ever see or talk to your BIL ever again, you're going to have to tell your husband. This isn't some stranger at a bar. Or even a coworker. Stuff with family members is super duper messy, because it's going to come out eventually. Your husband already seems to know and instead of fully confessing, you are gaslighting him, hoping to alleviate your guilt and hoping it will change the facts. But the facts are, you've ALREADY blown up your marriage whether or not your husband ever finds out about the physical cheating, because he no longer trusts you. You had an affair. Accept that. I highly recommend individual counseling. You are going to have to come clean and tell him. The least you owe him is honesty, so that he can decide what he wants to do. He may choose to work on things with you in couples counseling. He may decide he's done. But the longer you wait to tell him the truth, while he suspects it anyway, is going to make everything worse. Continuing to lie to him after already cheating on him will blow up any chance for a reconciliation. Sorry, but this is your BIL- there's just no way on earth your husband is never going to find out. And if he doesn't hear it from you, the worse it will be. If this was just a momentary lapse of judgment and kissed once and stopped it before it went further, I'd say let it go. But you slept with him. It takes a LOT of YES's to reach the point of sleeping with someone- there's so many "checkpoints" you have to go thru and you made that decision. Time to face the consequences of your affair. Your husband is never going to stop questioning until he reaches the truth. The only question is do you want him to hear it from you as a place to start to heal or thru the grapevine in a manner that will assuredly obliterate any hope for future reconciliation?

Let's make one thing clear- She's NOT a stalker. I've had stalkers- I blocked them on everything and called the cops. I did NOT give them my cell phone number and communicate with them regularly- LOL. She's in his life because he LETS her be. Your real fear has nothing to do with this woman. Your real feel you've expressed here. You and your BF have not reached a place where you both feel comfortable being completely honest with each other. THAT's your real issue.