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Cities where women (greatly) outnumber men aren't common, so don't be disappointed if most of us don't experience it. It's the norm that men outnumber or equal the number of women present at most social events I attend. Easiest dates? Attractive women, unquestionably. They don't give many signals of interest and also are a bit jaded. They might give you the time of day if you can get past the {mod edit} tests and {mod edit} shields first. That won't keep a lot of guys from trying, and she'll get many wannabe suitors. Pick and choose. That's as easy as it gets when it comes to getting date OFFERS, but that doesn't mean she necessarily dates more.

You're doing almost everything wrong. Hard to believe there are people who absolutely cannot help themselves out of a very bad situation. I'm talking about you. Get out now-she's just gonna use you and you'll be left out in the cold, heartbroken. You shouldn't care one bit for this chick. She obviously doesn't care about you or she would'nt be doing things like this.

Oh geez. Do you have to talk every day? Do you get to breathe? Aren't you dating anyone else?

She's has walked all over you and you're still undecided what to do? You're a babysitter to her, nothing more. If she's staying out all night you should figure she's hooking up with other guys as well. She's a bad mom and a druggie. You're 27 years old and falling for this? Why?

Strangely, the feminist women I've been around also wait for the man to take the initiative. There are some behaviors even the feminist will not abandon.

Okay, I'll clarify a bit. In the initial phases, the woman lets the man do all the initiating. (My experience). She lets him call, etc. etc. If/when she gets more comfortable with you, and regards you as a prospect, well, then, she opens up a lot more. I think a lot of the reasons we disagree is that we are of different genders. And I'm including all dating experiences, successful as well as unsucessful. They have one common thread. Women here want the man to do the initiative thing on the first few dates. It would be great if it were different, and I'm getting suggestions here that it is (my experience) not true elsewhere. If so, could you tell me where these places are so I could visit them sometime?

Truthfully, you're a little dogmatic about it. I don't think you have the numbers to back that up. As do most women who I've talked to about this very thing. Based on a few experiences, they cast a broad net. Ask and get rejected, and accepted, multiple times, then get back to me. That's unlikely, given feminine preferences in dating behavior. If you're going to take the initiative, understand what men do--the odds are against you. Don't let a few experiences color your behavior. I have had women ask me out. Granted, it's rare, but I've wound up dating some of them long term. And I know many guys who have had the same experience. You certainly don't come off as a feminist-in fact, you have more in common with a "Rules" girl than most. But unless you have asked out many men, and I'd guess you haven't (you say as much), your experiences are more due to the luck of the draw than anything else. The success of long term relationships are due to compatibility more than anything else, and not who asked first. In my experience, and those I know. Enough said. I'm done.

Batya, you're speculating about something that just don't happen. At least not to me and my circle of friends/acquaintances. The most I've ever heard of/received in the way of interest from women is the occasional phone call or text message, and darn few of those. Most women figure that a phone is a one way device, only designed to take incoming calls from men. I can't remember EVER having a woman doing all the initiating, or even more than a small fraction of it. Typically, they prefer to keep you guessing whether they even care at all. Usually you find out about their interest only if you're spinning other plates and are truly occupied yourself, and they are aware of this fact. Women have this weird radar that says you're only desirable if you're dating lots of other women-sorta the harem effect. (Obviously my experience, not a generalization). Most women shouldn't worry about throwing out the occasional contact to see what the guy is doing. This happens so infrequently (woman radar here) because they know not to overdo it. If you see that the guy is getting distant because you keep breaking/turning down dates, then yeah, ramp up the attention a little, because you're giving him nothing to go on. This is a much more likely scenario than what you're postulating.

My point is, is women asking men out is NOT ineffective or asking for a failed relationship. You're just setting yourself up for possible rejection, same as men must do. It doesn't work most of the time for men, and they get rejected more often than they get accepted. If you do the same thing, you face the same risks. Deal with it, or accept the passive role. I suspect you just don't want to go there, and that's the reason you don't ask; shielding yourself from rejection, pure and simple. That's fine, but that's no reason to say "it won't work." Men face the same low odds, and have little choice but to keep asking. It works for them if they persist and don't take the rejections personally, as they must do if they are to succeed. In a way, you have a choice, and men do not. They can't wait for women to ask or they'd never get a date. They are free to ask whomever they want, however, assuming they've got the nerve. Their odds go up if the women help them a little. Just meet us halfway, that's all we ask. We'll take over from there if we think we've got a chance.

Baty, agreed on most points. To again clarify-don't ever use "won't work out" as an excuse not to initiate-for either gender. Women are, I think, more dogmatic about never asking-because it is an unaccustomed role that carries risks. And I'm not talking about your behavior, just women that I know and am around. They'd sooner get burned at the stake or get hit by a truck than ask for a date and risk direct rejection. They'd rather stick to their more comfortable behavior of waiting and indirect suggestion. Less direct risk, and the more passive role. Just don't blame a failed relationship or date on something other than a lack of interest on the part of one of the participants (like female initiative). Lack of interest is the reason most don't work out, and we all have to play the odds. Use your own experience as an example-you took the lead in some ways, and it's working out, isn't it? It's a refutation of your argument. If you're compatible and interested, it will happen.

I'd have to say I disagree-at least if we are on the same page as regards "initiating". Granted, we both agree that women asking is okay, if rather rare. Women usually try to give "hints" instead, and run the risk of being misunderstood as just being friendly. Nobody said this was easy. The problem occurs after that-when you say you must keep asking to get the guy to go out with you. I think in this case you are blaming lack of initiative instead of lack of interest. That's why it's not working out, long term. The role reversal is also a bit uncomfortable for women. The woman is used to the man showing continued interest by asking her out repeatedly. When the man isn't doing much initiating, women feel uncomfortable and their relationship radar is giving off warning signs. Pay attention to it-it means the guy isn't interested. My point is that women shouldn't justify not taking the initiative on what "might" happen-asking a guy out doesn't turn him into a feminine wuss incapable of taking the lead. If he's interested, he'll take over and lead the woman like she wants him to.

I frankly find it pretty interesting that women are so dogmatic about never initiating, never making their interest obvious, etc. I always hear these tales from women about other women who have tried more direct behavior, and not having it work out. Hello? It doesn't work out most of the time. Got news for you. A guy, since he's the "initiator" gets rejected from a few to many times for each date he goes on. Sometimes the percentage is pretty low, and there are some bad stretches sometimes. That's the downside to the role of initiator. Perhaps you've got a taste of this rejection when you've made an "attempt" at switching roles for a change, and just don't like it? FWIW, your advice about waiting for the guy to call is right on target, imo. But I've also had a pretty good time with women who made their interest more obvious. That certainly didn't mean I thought of them as a "sure thing" or that she was desperate-the dates succeeded or failed for other reasons, not for anything to do with who asked whom. Suck it up and face the occasional rejection, or leave it up to the guys. Doesn't matter either way. Most women choose to let the guy handle it. Most of the problem is in reading the other person correctly, anyway.

Be careful who you listen to. Women like men with experience at sex; the inexperienced guy thinks he needs to be gentle, affectionate, sensitive, etc. BORING! You'll be lucky if she stays awake. Women want you to take them, and like it if you have the knowledge to do the same thing many different ways. The whole body is an erogenous zone; experienced guys know this. If you can't be experienced, at least be creative. How can you do it this time that wasn't exactly the same as last time? If women want you to do it in a particular "way" inexperienced guys take her at her word, get in a rut, and start to make her want to watch TV instead. So, be careful about reading some of their advice and taking it the wrong way. Repetitive sex is not as fun after awhile. You know you are doing well when she comments, "How many different ways can you DO that?" If you are inexperienced, don't make the mistake of being tentative. Women love hard, sweaty, assertive, go for it sex. Lust needs to be out there in plain view. The most important thing, though, is enthusiasm. Let her know that you thoroughly enjoy what you are doing to her and with her.

I agree with the previous post. Why should you send someone an email that lets them know you are upset? If he is playing you it will not help, and it is clear you are doing this in hopes of getting a response. You don't like waiting for an answer. If he treats you badly, why should you imply you still care what happens to him? You were honest. He was not. If he does call, and it is very late, then act all cool about it. Be friendly, giving no clue about your concern. DON"T lose your head. When he asks for a followup date, tell him you have your doubts, and his behavior crossed him off your list. Make it clear that your dumping him was all his fault. If he was willing to do this to you now, he would still do it at another time if you let him back in. Yes, it hurts, but men and women do this to each other all the time. You held up your end. Now hold him accountable for what he failed to do. No excuse he will give can justify not following through with his promises. Retain your dignity and ditch the creep.

Okay, some specific definitions are in order. Nice guy = Bad is not what I mean, and not the point. Women like nice guys just fine. However, dating is very different than being just friends with a nice guy. Women befriend many guys who they will not date. Generally, the longer you are in the "friends" zone with women, the harder it is for them to consider you a boyfriend. The problem is, most nice guys are inexperienced with women. They think, "I'll just treat her extra nice, which is what she says she wants, and she'll be mine!" Strangely, attentiveness, punctuality, and consideration are some behaviors that tend to bore a lot of women. (Remember, judge what they do, NOT what they say). They think that the guy doesn't have any other prospects if he is TOO attentive and available. If he seems overeager, it is a turnoff. If he calls too much, another turnoff. Declaring you'll wait for a girl (while she is dating other guys) is pretty much the kiss of death. It implies she can ignore you (sexually) while she cats around herself. That's "nice guy" behavior, which is distinct from being nice to someone. "Nice guys" tend to repress their sexuality to avoid offending the women they are with. Bad boy behavior that women find attractive? Confidence, unpredictability, NOT boring, spontaneous, experienced, and willing to make no bones about their sexual interest in a woman. They don't give a rip about gaining her approval. In fact, it looks like they just don't care. THAT's the main thing-really, truly having a lot of other women available who would love to go on a date with you. Women can smell fake confidence and fake bad boy behavior a mile away. You've got to really know how to apply it and mean it, or they'll figure it out on a date. "NICE GUY" = UNCERTAINTY, INEXPERIENCE. CLINGY, FIXATED, DESPERATE You might state you don't do any of those things, yet you are labeled a "nice guy." However, is that your perception of how you behave or the woman's? She doesn't necessarily see things the way you do, and some of your behavior may strike them as being in the capitalized categories listed above. If you have tried to date a lot of women that befriended you instead of making you a boyfriend, then you might be exhibiting nice guy behavior. Poor success at dating means you are either a total jerk or, worse yet, perceived as a "nice guy." The sad part is that total jerks have more success at dating than the "nice guy". How to avoid "nice guy" behavior? Date many women. Observe what they react positively to and the games they play. Respond appropriately. The more women you date and the more experience you have with their tests the better catch you'll be, because you know how to act around women. There is no substitute for dating experience. None whatsoever. Theorizing is not adequate. You've got to attend the school of hard knocks to get good at it. The successful man learns to eliminate the behaviors that turn women off that are attributed to "nice guys." Notice I said nothing about treating women badly. There is never an excuse for that.